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What Religious Days Did Jesus Observe?
Good News Magazine ^ | March/April 2004 | Roger Foster

Posted on 03/25/2005 12:29:50 PM PST by DouglasKC

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To: D-fendr
How are the fundamental beliefs of your local church determined?

By vote of the congregation. Officially, we associate and hold to United Church of God's fundamental beliefs by consensus because it most accurately reflects our biblical beliefs.

How are teachers/preachers of these beliefs disciplined or held to teaching according to these beliefs?

From the biblical example:

Mat 18:15 "If your brother sins, go and show him his fault in private; if he listens to you, you have won your brother.
Mat 18:16 "But if he does not listen to you, take one or two more with you, so that BY THE MOUTH OF TWO OR THREE WITNESSES EVERY FACT MAY BE CONFIRMED.
Mat 18:17 "If he refuses to listen to them, tell it to the church; and if he refuses to listen even to the church, let him be to you as a Gentile and a tax collector.

In the three years that I've been attending with United I haven't heard of any kind of discipline being imposed in our local congregations. I've heard that disfellowshiping occurs sometimes in other congregations, but it's almost always reserved for those who actively attempt to sow discord by vocally and continually opposing the beliefs of the rest of the church. Most of the "hot button" issues are left as a matter of personal conscience.

141 posted on 03/29/2005 4:50:55 AM PST by DouglasKC
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To: DouglasKC
"If you are saying that omission of specific instruction in the bible is permission to disregard the bible on God's holy days then it's also permission to disregard the bible in every other moral precept and law that God enumerated in the old testament."

This is a false dichotomy.

This letter was in regard to the Jews wanting the gentiles to observe the law. These holy days were something that were unique to judaism. This letter was directed toward this issue of the gentile having to observe the things of the Law or not. There is no mention in this letter of the ceremonial cleansing, the dietary laws, or the holy days. Things that should be essential according to you, but it seems the Holy Spirit saw otherwise.

Also, verse 21 is not even included in the letter.

The entire book of Galatians deals with this issue. After having been saved through faith are you now trying to be perfected by the Law?

JM
142 posted on 03/29/2005 5:53:53 AM PST by JohnnyM
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To: DouglasKC

What are the fundamental beliefs of the body of Christ? How are they determined, and how do they differ from those of the United Church of God?


143 posted on 03/29/2005 8:30:58 AM PST by D-fendr
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To: JohnnyM
This letter was in regard to the Jews wanting the gentiles to observe the law. These holy days were something that were unique to judaism. This letter was directed toward this issue of the gentile having to observe the things of the Law or not. There is no mention in this letter of the ceremonial cleansing, the dietary laws, or the holy days. Things that should be essential according to you, but it seems the Holy Spirit saw otherwise.

That still doesn't invalidate my point. You're trying to say that the holy days were not taught because the holy days were not referenced in the letter. The ten commandments for the most part were also not mentioned in the letter. They were as much a part of the law, if not more so, then the holy days. By your logic, gentile converts weren't being taught to refrain from killing, worshipping false Gods or worshipping idols.

Your statement that the holy days were unique to Judaism is perhaps technically accurate, but biblically there are examples of non-Jews not only observing, but worshipping at God's Holy Days:

Joh 12:20 And there were certain Greeks among them that came up to worship at the feast:

Also, verse 21 is not even included in the letter

It doesn't matter. Verse 21 was an explanation of WHY they didn't include MORE in the letter:

Act 15:20 Instead, we should write a letter telling them to keep away from things polluted by false gods, from sexual sins, from eating the meat of strangled animals, and from eating bloody meat.
Act 15:21 After all, Moses' words have been spread to every city for generations. His teachings are read in synagogues on every day of worship.

For generation people had been learning about the Holy Days. This was the normative cultural and scriptural thing to do. It was commanded by God in the only holy scriptures they had. Of course they were observing them. The only thing that makes you think they weren't is that your are looking backward under the prism of your current beliefs and current tradition.

144 posted on 03/29/2005 4:57:51 PM PST by DouglasKC
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To: D-fendr
What are the fundamental beliefs of the body of Christ? How are they determined, and how do they differ from those of the United Church of God?

Naturally I believe that the fundamental beliefs of the United Church of God are the most accurate representation of the fundamental beliefs of the body of Christ or else I would worship elsewhere. There is no specific written statement in scripture that lists the fundamental beliefs of the body of Christ such as United or any modern church has...although Hebrews 6:1 and 6:2 come close. However, I believe that scripture contains all of the fundamental beliefs of the body of Christ and that those in the body of Christ are led by the spirit of God to understand them.

145 posted on 03/29/2005 5:26:37 PM PST by DouglasKC
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To: DouglasKC
In Acts 21 we have yet another example of this. Paul comes to Jerusalem and the saved Jews are upset because he is telling others not to observe the Law of Moses and James says this in verse 25:

"But concerning the Gentiles who have believed, we wrote, having decided that they should abstain from meat sacrificed to idols and from blood and from what is strangled and from fornication."

Here James is restating the point that the Gentiles need not walk according to the customs, which would include the Holy Days and dietary laws, except for those mentioned in the letter.

Once again, why send them a letter at all? If they were to observe the customs and Laws as you say, then there was no need for the letter for this is what you say they were being taught anyway. Or if what you say is true, why not say so in the letter to clear up the confusion that was arising? They were having the same issues we are talking about now. They cleared it up by saying to just observe these essential and you will do well. If observing the feasts were essential, as you say, would that not have been mentioned? Plus, Acts 15:21 was NOT included in the letter nor is it mentioned in Acts 21.

JM
146 posted on 03/30/2005 5:59:42 AM PST by JohnnyM
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To: JohnnyM
Here James is restating the point that the Gentiles need not walk according to the customs, which would include the Holy Days and dietary laws, except for those mentioned in the letter.
Once again, why send them a letter at all? If they were to observe the customs and Laws as you say, then there was no need for the letter for this is what you say they were being taught anyway. Or if what you say is true, why not say so in the letter to clear up the confusion that was arising?

These were the minimum requirements for gentiles to initially follow in order to get along with the jews. The early church was a co-mingling of Christian Jews and converted gentiles. Many of jews still had hangups about cermonial and traditional rules when it came to associating with gentiles. A good example of this is in Galatians chapter 2. Remember that many of these laws and traditions were manmade...not scriptural.

So the converted jews were insisting that in order to be SAVED one had to observe ALL the law of Moses:

Act 15:1 And certain men which came down from Judaea taught the brethren, and said, Except ye be circumcised after the manner of Moses, ye cannot be saved.

Of course that's not true. One doesn't have to observe all the laws or Moses...or any of them to be saved. One only has to receive God's spirit, as the gentiles had.

BUT, there was still the issue of obedience to God's laws. Obedience to God's law comes as one learns and grows spiritually.

Please note that I am not advocating that all of the old testament laws still need to be followed. Paul makes it clear exactly which ones were obviated by Christ...primarily the laws pertaining to sacrifice and any and all functions related to the Levitical priesthood.

So the council at Jerusalem outlined the minimum requirements needed to preserve peace among the differing brethren...because after all they would learn the rest in the synagogue every sabbath.

Act 15:20 But that we write unto them, that they abstain from pollutions of idols, and from fornication, and from things strangled, and from blood.
Act 15:21 For Moses of old time hath in every city them that preach him, being read in the synagogues every sabbath day.

A further point about the holy days: I believe the holy days exist above and beyond any of the covenants. They are apart from any law, past or present. The proof of this is that they still exist in the future after Christ returns to earth:

Zec 14:16 And it shall come to pass, that every one that is left of all the nations which came against Jerusalem shall even go up from year to year to worship the King, the LORD of hosts, and to keep the feast of tabernacles.
Zec 14:17 And it shall be, that whoso will not come up of all the families of the earth unto Jerusalem to worship the King, the LORD of hosts, even upon them shall be no rain

147 posted on 03/31/2005 6:18:48 PM PST by DouglasKC
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