THE MATHEMATICAL SIGNATURE OF GOD IN THE WORDS OF SCRIPTURE [INCREDIBLE PROOF]

Thank you for the additional clue!

I'm still meditating on the wings in Revelation 4. It's one of those subjects wherein I have to concentrate on not approaching it mentally - so that any Truth which I am to know can be revealed. And it could be that I am not to see anything further at this time.

Exodus, on the other hand, instantly brings images in the Spirit - most all of which are figures (or "types") pertaining to spiritual Truth - heaven and earth - created ages past, present and future. But whether they are what you have in mind, I cannot say.

Thank you so very much for all your kind encouragements!

"My friend of the world, whoso you are: Either Jesus Christ is mistaken or you are.

Wrong. A wonderful example of a false dichotomy.

The answer that neither might be is only evading the issue, not settling it.

Whoever wrote that sentence clearly doesn't understand simple English. It is not evading anything to suggest that the correct answer lies outside the two possibilities already mentioned.

But the ages have decided that Jesus Christ was not mistaken.

No, they haven't, but one is certainly free to think otherwise.

It is for you to decide whether you shall continue to be."

Yawn. The black crow flies at midnight.

But you still did not answer my fundamental question: Why the need to "discover" 63 (or some other multiple of seven) books on the OT? Isn't Grant really just forcing his hypothesis on the Bible? If you look hard enough you have "discover" patterns everywhere. Where has God told us that He built some self-authenticating pattern into the structure of the Bible for us to "discover"

I can try to guess that Grant would say 63 books is how many there are, 36 (12 x 3) in the Old Testament and 27(three cubed) in the New Testament. As for God telling us about it, I’m sure that there are still things undiscovered in the Bible that God did not tell us about.

I had time to read your link, the open letter to Jeffery Grant. I don’t think we are on the same page here. There is a numerical structure in scripture. I don’t make any claim as to the meaning of the structure, but we can develop the meaning of the numbers by the way that they are used

It is true that you can “discover” patterns everywhere if you look hare enough. You can also us statistical analyses to determine the probably if the patterns are random or “by design.”

The same thing is true with all the other information provided by Grant, et al. You either believe it or you don't. Your belief rests entirely on the authority of Grant, since it cannot be demonstrated conclusively from the divine Word.

As I see it there are several questions here; is there a numerical structure? Can it be demonstrated conclusively? If there is, who put is there God or man or chance? What is it for? Is it profitable? Here, lets look at the acrostics. The arguments that I use here are the same as for the numbers. Since it is in scripture, it is automatically profitable, and we can toss out the first question. Scripture does not tell us that the acrostics have meaning at all.

Psalm 119 is a regular acrostic. Every 8 verses begin with the same letter and there are 22 sections of 8 verses each, for each letter of the Hebrew alphabet, in alphabetical order of course.

I’m not real comfortable with using statistics or probability to interpret scripture, neither do I toss out common sense. The odds that this could happen accidentally are near zero. But they are not zero. But this is a “regular” acrostic, what about an irregular acrostic? I’ll be honest here, this is what drew me in. I know that even as difficult as Psalm 119 would be to write as an acrostic, it would be something that men could do.

When we ask the question, would God Write an acrostic we cannot be conclusive on our answer. But when we ask, would God write an acrostic with letters missing, it is a little more thought provoking. Was God unable to make all of the letters fit properly? This could be one reason few people credited God for the acrostics. The absence of one or more letters, occurs three times scripture. If men did this, we have no reason to pursue any meaning in it. But “all scripture is inspired by God.” Read what F. W. Grant said about one such case;

"In the ninth and tenth psalms, we find again an alphabetic structure, but this time with much more irregularity. Here, one alphabet runs through the two psalms, and unites them together. There are certain omissions which I need not dwell upon in the ninth psalm. The tenth begins regularly with the needed "L," But there it stops: from the second to the eleventh verse inclusive there is no trace of alphabet. Six letters are gone, although the six divisions representing them are there. Then with the twelfh verse, "Arise, O Lord," the alphabet begins again, and from this it goes on regularly to the end of the psalm. This tenth psalm has naturally been a cause of trouble to the commentators. They did not know what had become of the missing letters. There was an apparent confusion in it which did not seem as if it could be designed at all. Some have set it down to mere inability in the writer to carry out his plan all through. Some, with more reverence, have imagined an accident to the psalm in its transmission, and Bishop Horsley tried to rearrange the verses so as to get the alphabet in order, as he thought it must have been at first; but it would not yield itself to his management at all. Because the psalm as it stands is perfect, and the apparent disorder is designed. Can we interpret it? In measure, at least, beloved friends, I think we can.

The two psalms are connected in matter as in structure, and the common subject is, The day of the Lord, - God's triumph over the wicked in the last days. The tenth psalm takes up especially one wicked one, who comes into terrible prominence in the prophecies of those days. I need not speak more of him, for my purpose is not at all interpretation now, but I want you to notice that it is just the description of this wicked one which occupies the gap in this alphabetic structure of the psalm. Before it comes to him, there is regularity of structure. After the description of him is ended, there is regularity again. But when he is before the view, the order of the psalm is apparently destroyed. Beneath the surface it is still there: the six divisions answering to the letters are all there, although the letters themselves are absent; there is an apparent interruption of God's ways, - only apparent. Patiently He seems to endure the evil, - "keeping silence," as He Himself expresses it, - until the due time of judgment comes, the harvest-time for which all has been ripening. Then His purposes, never set aside, come into open light. How significantly the structure speaks here, and what order is in this disorder! But it is not only in the Psalms that we find such things as these."

The difficulty of writing an irregular acrostic that could not be tampered with is much more complicated. If some scribe was able to substitute words with the proper letters to complete the alphabet. It would probably be adopted as canon. Most people would assume a mistake had been corrected. Of course Scripture cannot be broken and God did not allow that to happen.

The point I’m trying to make here is that God does not tell us specifically what neat things that he has put into the book. I remember when my children were young, I enjoyed watching them figure things out. I believe that we get that nature from God, for we are created in his image. God smiles when we find the provisions that he has left for us to carry for a time and share with others. Did he tell us he would leave provisions or not? I’ll leave it for you to ponder. Ruth 2:16

Blessings
Seven

Thanks for posting that here, I'm working on HTML, but I'm pressed for time these days. I was blessed by 298 too!

Seven

Thank you so much for your kind encouragements!

And thank you for posting that excerpt concerning the irregularity in the Psalms. How fascinating.

I was immediately impressed that the structure is like a figure for the end of Revelation 13 and the beginning of Revelation 14. Here are the verses:

Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number [is] Six hundred threescore [and] six. - Rev 13:18

And I looked, and, lo, a Lamb stood on the mount Sion, and with him an hundred forty [and] four thousand, having his Father's name written in their foreheads. - Rev 14:1

A figure is a contemporaneous model of things to come (or as they actually exist in heaven).

The Holy Ghost this signifying, that the way into the holiest of all was not yet made manifest, while as the first tabernacle was yet standing: Which [was] a figure for the time then present, in which were offered both gifts and sacrifices, that could not make him that did the service perfect, as pertaining to the conscience; [Which stood] only in meats and drinks, and divers washings, and carnal ordinances, imposed [on them] until the time of reformation. – Hebrews 9:8-10

What came to mind is the omission of six letters in Psalms 10 (in discussing wicked man) - followed immediately in Psalms by "Arise, Oh Lord" and ending wickedness "that the man of the earth may no more oppress" ... as perhaps looking forward to the mystery (as in not yet revealed to us) concerning the number of the man which is the beast (three sixes) followed immediately by the Lord standing on Mount Zion and ending wickedness on earth and altogether (Revelation 19).

My two cents … for what it’s worth.

concerning the number of the man which is the beast (three sixes) followed immediately by the Lord standing on Mount Zion and ending wickedness on earth and altogether (Revelation 19).

Thahk you A-G. I have memorized much of the scripture, including Hebrews and Revelation and I have not seen that before. "Chapter 14" may have got in the way. It does reinforce my tagline though. Seven

Thank you for your reply! Indeed, the Scriptures are feast for us.

If I know anything about the rabid naysayers on FR, at least some of the RELIGIOUS [vs spiritual] types will wail and rant that ANYTHING having to do with numbers and The Bible has to be crossing the line into dealing with Biblically forbidden NUMEROLOGY.

I'm not a naysayer, but I normally stay away from Numerology topics because many people use this topic to try to predict when our Lord will return. They will always be wrong.

I do want to thank you for posting this. My daughter has been witnessing to her cousin for two years and the cousin 'thinks' that she has scientifically proven that there is no God. She keeps coming back and is getting closer, so this might be a good article to give her. Thank you.

Please pray for my family.

You're shocked that I think someone's *opinion* on the "mathematical signature of God" is unimportant compared to everything we are exhorted to do in the New Testament?

P.S. Be careful how you judge as "earnestness".

Correction:

P.S. Be careful how you judge "earnestness".

Thank you for posting, and agreed.

What really bothers me here is that it was evident from the first post that some feel if one does not agree with this "mathematical signature" theory, one is a "naysayer" or "not earnest". Or in other more honest words: "incorrect", "without faith", "sinning", "un-Christian", whatever.

That's very dangerous and truly wrong mentality to take.

Being an Atheist I might not understand, but what the hell is it that makes believers want to provide proof that their faith is true? Doesn't that nullify the whole point of faith?

I don't need it, either. There must be better things to do out there.

It's one thing . . .

--for a trobriand islander to have faith that his ancester has become a shark because tradition teaches him that.

--for a island's people to have faith in the cargo cult belief that whites will again come with airplanes loaded with gooies because they once did.

--in the Resurrection of Jesus The Christ who was born; lived; died and rose again precisely according to (depending on one's count) 30-100 specific predictions made more than 400 years before His birth; who was observed running around loose eating, teaching, socializing by more than 500 witnesses--many of whom were alive when key narratives were written down and distributed within 30-50 years of the events.

Blind, psychotic faith in a sky hook is one thing.

Discerning, informed, studied faith built on a solid foundation of sound, multiple sourced, verified evidence is something else.

Yes, it is my belief that God has gone to great lengths to make EVIDENCE FOR FAITH SOLID

AND

TENUOUS *ENOUGH* that FAITH is still required.

AND

that only those believing are affirmed dramatically, movingly forward in their faith after the initial steps. Helps keep the faithless riff/raff to a minimum.

This ALSO insures that God's eternal LEADERSHIP are trained in a bootcamp which EMPHASIZES FREE WILL CHOICE IN BEHALF OF SACRIFICAL LOVE. Decreases the risk of a satanic type revolt amongs the future heavenly leadership. The leaders are tested, tried, refined in the refiner's fires as to the authenticity of their faith and love for God and for one another.

No wonder "ALL CREATION WAITS EAGERLY, EXPECTANTLY AWAITING THE MANIFESTATION OF THE SONS OF GOD" to rule and reign with Christ over countless galactic clusters and countless ages.

The pollution of arrogance, violence, greed, selfishness etc. throughout creation has brought countless death and destruction.

God COULD have solved it by creating puppets, robots. Didn't suit His purposes. Only a faith-based LOVE RELATIONSHIP, freely chosen would do.

Therefore, there had to be a real alternative with real consequences. Otherwise, there was no choice.

However, in your/our era, God is evidenly going to wholesale change the . . . nature of the evidence.

He will be demonstrating His power, glory, majesty, authority abundantly vividly and repeatedly. People will evidently still curse God and die defiantly. But it won't be for lack of evidence of THE TRUTH to the contrary.

Sure, satan and his demonic and ET hoards will be mounting incredibly clever and powerful deceptions. So great, The Bible says, that IF it were possible, even the Believers would be deceived. Thankfully, the authentic ones won't be.

The historical evidence of the above is fascinating from this site--of which this is but one interesting page thereof:

http://www.alienresistance.org/bibleabductions.htm

The drama is intensifying. The Biblically predicted World government is waiting eagerly in the wings. We almost had a SKERRY who'd have turned the military over to the world government and brazenly said so in clever wording.

You can cling vainly to your atheism or decide that THE BOSS

IS

THE BOSS and behave more rationally accordingly.

Thankfully, THE BOSS

IS

WORTHY.

Thankfully HE IS LOVE; MERCY; BLESSING; ABUNDANCE . . .

He is NOT some BORG like entity obliterating all personality.

Becoming more His 'LOVE-SLAVE' results in individuals becoming MORE FREE and MORE their unique individual personalities in richer, fuller ways.

Refusing that option results in implosions of selfishness, meaninglessness, extreme isolation, extreme bleakness . . .

Thankfully, the choice is clear.

Thankfully, it's NOT the roll of meaningless cosmic dice.

The idiotic lie that all this arose incomprehensively out of chaos with endless repeated design building consecutive rolls of some cosmic dice never did make much rational sense.

It's one thing . . .

--for a trobriand islander to have faith that his ancester has become a shark because tradition teaches him that.

--for a island's people to have faith in the cargo cult belief that whites will again come with airplanes loaded with gooies because they once did.

--in the Resurrection of Jesus The Christ who was born; lived; died and rose again precisely according to (depending on one's count) 30-100 specific predictions made more than 400 years before His birth; who was observed running around loose eating, teaching, socializing by more than 500 witnesses--many of whom were alive when key narratives were written down and distributed within 30-50 years of the events.

Blind, psychotic faith in a sky hook is one thing.

Discerning, informed, studied faith built on a solid foundation of sound, multiple sourced, verified evidence is something else.

Yes, it is my belief that God has gone to great lengths to make EVIDENCE FOR FAITH SOLID

AND

TENUOUS *ENOUGH* that FAITH is still required.

AND

that only those believing are affirmed dramatically, movingly forward in their faith after the initial steps. Helps keep the faithless riff/raff to a minimum.

This ALSO insures that God's eternal LEADERSHIP are trained in a bootcamp which EMPHASIZES FREE WILL CHOICE IN BEHALF OF SACRIFICAL LOVE. Decreases the risk of a satanic type revolt amongs the future heavenly leadership. The leaders are tested, tried, refined in the refiner's fires as to the authenticity of their faith and love for God and for one another.

No wonder "ALL CREATION WAITS EAGERLY, EXPECTANTLY AWAITING THE MANIFESTATION OF THE SONS OF GOD" to rule and reign with Christ over countless galactic clusters and countless ages.

The pollution of arrogance, violence, greed, selfishness etc. throughout creation has brought countless death and destruction.

God COULD have solved it by creating puppets, robots. Didn't suit His purposes. Only a faith-based LOVE RELATIONSHIP, freely chosen would do.

Therefore, there had to be a real alternative with real consequences. Otherwise, there was no choice.

However, in your/our era, God is evidenly going to wholesale change the . . . nature of the evidence.

He will be demonstrating His power, glory, majesty, authority abundantly vividly and repeatedly. People will evidently still curse God and die defiantly. But it won't be for lack of evidence of THE TRUTH to the contrary.

Sure, satan and his demonic and ET hoards will be mounting incredibly clever and powerful deceptions. So great, The Bible says, that IF it were possible, even the Believers would be deceived. Thankfully, the authentic ones won't be.

The historical evidence of the above is fascinating from this site--of which this is but one interesting page thereof:

http://www.alienresistance.org/bibleabductions.htm

The drama is intensifying. The Biblically predicted World government is waiting eagerly in the wings. We almost had a SKERRY who'd have turned the military over to the world government and brazenly said so in clever wording.

You can cling vainly to your atheism or decide that THE BOSS

IS

THE BOSS and behave more rationally accordingly.

Thankfully, THE BOSS

IS

WORTHY.

Thankfully HE IS LOVE; MERCY; BLESSING; ABUNDANCE . . .

He is NOT some BORG like entity obliterating all personality.

Becoming more His 'LOVE-SLAVE' results in individuals becoming MORE FREE and MORE their unique individual personalities in richer, fuller ways.

Refusing that option results in implosions of selfishness, meaninglessness, extreme isolation, extreme bleakness . . .

Thankfully, the choice is clear.

Thankfully, it's NOT the roll of meaningless cosmic dice.

The idiotic lie that all this arose incomprehensively out of chaos with endless repeated design building consecutive rolls of some cosmic dice never did make much rational sense.

It's one thing . . .

--for a trobriand islander to have faith that his ancester has become a shark because tradition teaches him that.

--for a island's people to have faith in the cargo cult belief that whites will again come with airplanes loaded with gooies because they once did.

--in the Resurrection of Jesus The Christ who was born; lived; died and rose again precisely according to (depending on one's count) 30-100 specific predictions made more than 400 years before His birth; who was observed running around loose eating, teaching, socializing by more than 500 witnesses--many of whom were alive when key narratives were written down and distributed within 30-50 years of the events.

Blind, psychotic faith in a sky hook is one thing.

Discerning, informed, studied faith built on a solid foundation of sound, multiple sourced, verified evidence is something else.

Yes, it is my belief that God has gone to great lengths to make EVIDENCE FOR FAITH SOLID

AND

TENUOUS *ENOUGH* that FAITH is still required.

AND

that only those believing are affirmed dramatically, movingly forward in their faith after the initial steps. Helps keep the faithless riff/raff to a minimum.

This ALSO insures that God's eternal LEADERSHIP are trained in a bootcamp which EMPHASIZES FREE WILL CHOICE IN BEHALF OF SACRIFICAL LOVE. Decreases the risk of a satanic type revolt amongs the future heavenly leadership. The leaders are tested, tried, refined in the refiner's fires as to the authenticity of their faith and love for God and for one another.

No wonder "ALL CREATION WAITS EAGERLY, EXPECTANTLY AWAITING THE MANIFESTATION OF THE SONS OF GOD" to rule and reign with Christ over countless galactic clusters and countless ages.

The pollution of arrogance, violence, greed, selfishness etc. throughout creation has brought countless death and destruction.

God COULD have solved it by creating puppets, robots. Didn't suit His purposes. Only a faith-based LOVE RELATIONSHIP, freely chosen would do.

Therefore, there had to be a real alternative with real consequences. Otherwise, there was no choice.

However, in your/our era, God is evidenly going to wholesale change the . . . nature of the evidence.

He will be demonstrating His power, glory, majesty, authority abundantly vividly and repeatedly. People will evidently still curse God and die defiantly. But it won't be for lack of evidence of THE TRUTH to the contrary.

Sure, satan and his demonic and ET hoards will be mounting incredibly clever and powerful deceptions. So great, The Bible says, that IF it were possible, even the Believers would be deceived. Thankfully, the authentic ones won't be.

The historical evidence of the above is fascinating from this site--of which this is but one interesting page thereof:

http://www.alienresistance.org/bibleabductions.htm

The drama is intensifying. The Biblically predicted World government is waiting eagerly in the wings. We almost had a SKERRY who'd have turned the military over to the world government and brazenly said so in clever wording.

You can cling vainly to your atheism or decide that THE BOSS

IS

THE BOSS and behave more rationally accordingly.

Thankfully, THE BOSS

IS

WORTHY.

Thankfully HE IS LOVE; MERCY; BLESSING; ABUNDANCE . . .

He is NOT some BORG like entity obliterating all personality.

Becoming more His 'LOVE-SLAVE' results in individuals becoming MORE FREE and MORE their unique individual personalities in richer, fuller ways.

Refusing that option results in implosions of selfishness, meaninglessness, extreme isolation, extreme bleakness . . .

Thankfully, the choice is clear.

Thankfully, it's NOT the roll of meaningless cosmic dice.

The idiotic lie that all this arose incomprehensively out of chaos with endless repeated design building consecutive rolls of some cosmic dice never did make much rational sense.

I think the naysayers have repeatedly over many threads

made their convictions abundantly clear.

If they wish to come across as exceedingly similar in content, tone, attitude to the RELIGIOUS leaders of certain dusty pathed days,

that's their business.

But I think it's worthwhile to note that.

Such stances don't seem to earn many brownie points with God.

I don't know for certain what an

individual heart

is set toward.

I merely observe the evidence. God only knows.

I don't want to judge hearts.

The evidence certainly seems strongly and repeatedly to indicate a certain sort of hazardous attitude, stance, repeated perspective

which I have found, having had the same attitude and perspective plenty of years

to be very hazardous in my relationship with God.

It would not be loving for me to fail to warn about that.

The Religious leaders of Jesus dusty pathed days were exceedingly earnest--toward the wrong goals.

Happy to pray for your family.

This book chapter has nothing to do with numerology or I would not have posted it. It is right to be avoidant toward numerology.

Thanks for your kind post.