If you can demonstrate that God is, what do you need faith for?
Posted on 11/14/2004 8:45:23 AM PST by Alamo-Girl
betty boop, Seven_0 and js1138 - y'all are pinged because things you have posted on other threads are included in the above article.
Generally to everyone, you've been pinged in the hopes that you would either have some moments of standing in awe that you'd like to mention - or that you have thought-provoking questions (like js1138's) to help enrich this research project.
Thanks to all contributors in advance!
Don't be offended if I merely lurk on this thread.
Thanks for the ping. A thoughtful post. Much to think about. I don't know what I can contribute, but I'll be following the thread with interest.
Wow, what an excellent compilation! Bookmarking with exclamation points for later perusal and indepth analysis. Thanks to all for putting your ideas together.
If you can demonstrate that God is, what do you need faith for?
"The most beautiful thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the source of all true art and all science. He to whom this emotion is a stranger, who can no longer pause to wonder and stand rapt in awe, is as good as dead: his eyes are closed.""My religion consists of a humble admiration of the illimitable superior spirit who reveals himself in the slight details we are able to perceive with our frail and feeble mind."
"What really interests me is whether God had any choice in the creation of the world."
bump for later
Good point.
At the same time, the Scriptures tell us that the heavens declare His glory and the firmament shows His handiwork - and that we are without excuse for not noticing. (Psalms 19, Romans 1)
Judeo/Christian faith is the substance of things hoped for and the evidence of things not seen. (Hebrews 11:1)
The reason we Christians believe, have faith, is that we hear Christ and He knows us. (John 10) Faith comes by hearing and hearing by the Word of God (Romans 10).
IOW, "faith" to a Christian is neither deaf nor blind - and although no proofs or signs are needed, the evidence of His being is ever noticed by those who believe.
Of course, I can't demonstrate that God is. To a non-believer I can't say do this and this and this and say that and you will find God.
There is plenty of evidence for God's existence, however, so much so that if you were to put it on trial, a jury would certainly decide in favor of God's existence.
But most of the atheists on these threads aren't seeking a preponderance of evidence but absolute empirical proof -- and asking for measurable evidence of the supernatural is pretty silly (illogical, irrational). The supernatural is by definition not bound by natural measurement.
God, of course, can prove Himself but even that can be reasoned away by the imaginative atheist i.e. it was something I wanted to believe in a moment of weakness, it was a strange event for which we don't have a natural explanation for but soon will etc.
So you need faith to believe in God but it is faith based on reason not foolishness.
Then by Hugh Everett there are as "many universes" as diversions of (human?) experience.
And I can't help but wonder, how many more "universes" lie beyond our event horizen? And could there be some connection to Everett in that?
Anyway, it's very difficult to figure without God, not least of which is so much "fine tuning" in our universe, with the slightest difference in just one parameter meaning we wouldn't be here to discuss it.
Thanks for this latest in a series of innovative threads.
Now here's a man who needs a Calvinist perspective. Ping the Gerbils?
Unfortunately, you will never bridge the divide between the spiritual and the natural, as it is not in man's power to do so.
Sounds like "The Secret Doctrine: the Synthesis of Science, Religion and Philosophy" by Helena Blavatsky.
"What really interests me is whether God had any choice in the creation of the world."
God has, had and always will have all choices He chooses.
Or else He is not God. Einstein is.
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