Michael Rose, author of "Goodbye, Good Men" comments on Hubbard!!

CruxNews.com via Roman Catholic Faithful (www.rcf.org) ^

[johnb2004]

We are not talking about some poor sap out trying to lead a good life as best as he could. We are talking about someone who promotes a perverted lifestyle. Someone who leads others into sin. Read your bible. What did Christ say about those who lead others to sin?

See, I see this a case where thousands of souls teeter in the balance. You see it as a just man who is wrongly accused.

I have folks in my family who were unjustly accused of crimes. They still have nightmares. They have had counseling. They are not the same. I agree with you. False accusations are evil. We are not talking about those issues here. Hubbard has done much worse than what those two men accuse him of. He leads souls off the road to salvation. It is not the ends justify the means. It is that Hubbard is killing souls. He must go.

[dsc]

"Bonneau also allegedly remembers exactly what Hubbard paid."

In 1957 a Tootsie Roll cost five cents. A comic book was a dime. A hamburger at the drug store was thirty-five cents, and so was a milk shake. It cost twenty-five cents to get into the swimming pool, and the same to get into the Skytrain movie theater. I remember that. This guy isn't going to remember how much he was selling his body for? Get real.

[dsc]

"And he does not say he was seduced when on the street: He admits he was a prostitute. He "remembers" one client of many, 20 years later."

If he were going to remember one of many, surely that one would be the (gag) "street priest."

[johnb2004]

Too many innocent men have been accused of incest by false memory syndrome.

True. It is, also, true that too many have been lead into error by Hubbard. It is also true Hubbard is a traitor to his faith. It is also true that the homosexual mafia has infiltrated the Church and seeks the destruction of immortal souls.

[St.Chuck]

What is this I think business ??? It is not exactly a reflection of personal conviction from Hubbard's own priest. He only thinks because he is not so sure ??? How interesting choice of words.

I found this post to be somewhat humorous. You are disparaging a man's opinion because he said " I think..."? I am pleased that he has given his opinion the endorsement of his reasoning powers as opposed to "I feel....."

[sinkspur]

This guy isn't going to remember how much he was selling his body for?

There were two different encounters, and two different amounts.

Do you remember the exact titles of two of the many comic books you bought?

[sinkspur]

Hubbard has done much worse than what those two men accuse him of. He leads souls off the road to salvation. It is not the ends justify the means. It is that Hubbard is killing souls. He must go.

So, any means will do to get rid of him, right?

False accusations are great if they serve a higher purpose, right?

Why not just kill him? It would save everybody a lot of time and money.

[dsc]

Dennis the Menace in Hawaii and Tubby's Clubhouse Pals.

[johnb2004]

So, any means will do to get rid of him, right?

I did not say that. I guess it depends on whether you believe in the value of a soul. I will leave it to the moral theologians to answer.

False accusations are great if they serve a higher purpose, right?

Again, your words. I have stated before that false allegations are wrong.

Why not just kill him? It would save everybody a lot of time and money.

Straw man.

[NYer]

Did the two page suicide note come out?

His death has not yet been ruled a suicide. A two page note was found next to his body and given to his immediate family. The family has not published the note.

The autopsy results have not yet been released either. It has only been established that he was taking some sort of heart medication. That could be anything. I also read somewhere that his father died from a heart condition, when he was in his mid fifties.

[rcath60]

Where did you hear it was a two-page note. Also, what do you mean the note was "given" to his immediate family? His sister found him dead. Did she not find the note at that time?

[NYer]

Actually, I don't know how the note grew from one to two pages.

According to the TU ..

"Patricia Minkler told Watervliet police that she went to the 2319 Seventh St. home of her brother, the Rev. John Minkler, on Sunday after getting a call from another Catholic priest."

She found her brother on the kitchen floor, face-down on a blanket, and called police at about 1:48 p.m. for help with an "attempted suicide," according to the police report. Firefighters at the scene determined that he was dead, the report said.

Minkler left a note near his body, but its contents have not been disclosed by Thomas, who is conducting an investigation into the death. District Attorney Paul Clyne said the note probably will not be made public.

FULL STORY

[m4629]

All this was supposed to be in a very small park in a small city, not NYC under mayor dinkins. The standards were a bit different back then.

I take it you are just making an assumption here, in a subject you may or may not have any hands on experience. Places are like people, they have reputations.

Both the diocese as well as the DA Paul Clyne would have no trouble verifying the reputation of Washington Park as a "cruiser' paradise" back then, just as any cop in any city could tell you where the "lovers' lane" is. Your assumption is lame at best.

A "runaway" at 13? the article says 15.

I am now seeing perhaps you have not followed the 25 or so threads on this Hubbard mess. The reports covered the period in which Bonneau was between 13 and 15, between 76 and 79. Either way, he was a minor. I strongly recommend you at least browse thru the threads.

And he does not say he was seduced when on the street: He admits he was a prostitute.

We dealt with this on my last post. The issue is Hubbard soliciting sex from a minor, which makes it exploitation doesn't matter how you cut it.

He "remembers" one client of many, 20 years later.

This issue was also dealt with this issue on my last post. But allow me to add something here. Perhaps if you had treated junkies in your medical practice you could appreciate how some of them have very vivid flashbacks of extraordinary or traumatic events from dropping acids. You were correct in so far as "doing a neighborhood priest" out of the hundreds of regular Johns is a very small part of the trade, but it would be classified as "special events". You have not presented any credible arguments to discount Bonneau's account otherwise.

Follow the money before you throw out a bishop on unsupported hearsay evidence that pops up twenty years later. If the bishop was as bad as this article implies, all one has to do is see who he has seduced in the last 5 years. Or if he goes to gay bars. the pedophiles in Boston had a track record of repeated abuse and gay behavior. But any innocent person can be accused of abuse, and twenty years after the fact, one simply can't assume the story is correct, even if the witness thinks he or she is correct.

Ah yes, followed the money we have, more than you might have imagined. I recommend you start with the "henry" letter written by Fr. John Minkler to Cardinal O'Conner. Minkler also forwarded this letter to a few others years before his death.

In that "henry letter" with additional handwrittings by Minkler when he faxed it to Steve Brady, names of 23 homo priets as well as Hubbard and others are clearly identified, their despicable activaties are laid out. The letter was written in 1995, since then, quite a few of those priests have since been found guilty of sexual misconduct and defrocked. NYer's own pastor's name appeared in that letter 3 times. These facts stand on their own.

Hubbard was the one who brought in many of these queers with enormous damage done, in addition to subsequent attempts of fancy coverup. Even Hubbard himself admitted in public he was "less than transparent" in dealing with these matters. His track record is there for all to see. There is no need to defend the indefensible.

Too many innocent men have been accused of incest by false memory syndrome. And even recent crimes with eye witnesses have resulted in false accusations of look alikes...(and this doesn't even get into false claims for money or revenge)

Hubbard had been identified by 2 dead men with supporting material, and one live witness. No way he can get out of this.

Hubbard is all done.

His quarter is up. Tilt. Game over.

[GirlShortstop]

Minkler left a note near his body, but its contents have not been disclosed by Thomas, who is conducting an investigation into the death. District Attorney Paul Clyne said the note probably will not be made public.

I just had a thought:   maybe this "note" was something Minkler was working on trying to resolve his anxiety about the henry letter.   His sister got a call from that other priest (I never did see the relationship established between the three of them) that Fr. Minkler was upset to the point of being/feeling ill, and that she should check on him.  Patricia arrives and finds her brother dead and thinks the worst (explains attempted suicide), but actually it was natural causes (heart attack).  Has this been tossed around before?  If it has, I'll go back and read through my pings.

[rcath60]

I have been in this diocese for over 50 years. I have watched my beautiful Roman Catholic faith erode starting from my Catholic high school in the 60's and 70's. The changes that occurred in that school's (and all the Catholic elementary schools, high schools and religious ed. programs) teachings from the time I graduated to my youngest sibling's graduation many years later is phenomenal. I have witnessed the slow erosion. I have so far seen two of my three children complete Confirmation programs that taught them NOTHING. I have taught them their faith. I have had to take them to churches where the celebrant at Mass believes in the real presence and doesn't refer to it as cookie worship. I have taken them to confession to St. Francis Chapel in Wolf Road Shoppers park in Albany because our pastor DOESN'T OFFER ANY SCHEDULED CONFESSIONS!!! He also tore down our beautiful three-dimensional stations and left the church without stations for over two years until he replaced them with the new standard here--10" x 10" pictures relegated to the back of the church. This pastor gives a sermon on how artistic the movie "An American Beauty" is (which was one of the most disgusting movies I have ever attempted to watch), but never about the meaning of the readings. Parishoners found a statue of the Sacred Heart shoved into one of the confessionals (before they were ripped out) and when they asked what was going to be done with it, he told them to take it if they wanted because he was just going to throw it out! In the Minkler letter, this priest is referred to as the "mental case." And I can tell you that he IS one. I was told when I called the diocese about him that "some people were never meant to be pastors, but because of the shortage...". Give me a break!!! This is an agenda. This parish was one of the most vibrant, generous, growing parishes for four generations. This man was sent to close this church...mark my words. Attendance is WAY DOWN. I know of priests who don't have parishes who WERE meant to be pastors, but because they don't fit Hubbard's agenda, they are chaplains, or sent to the far reaches of the dioceses, away from their friends and relatives.
My children have learned NOTHING in religious ed classes in high school. My daughter's friend told me tonight that during their religion class last week, the teacher told them they could discuss anything they'd like. They "spent the entire class discussing Janet Jackson's boob," were her words.
I have my Catechism for Confirmation from 1966. It is a tiny book. I have told my daughter she cannot make her confirmation until she knows and understands what is in that book, and that is minimal. She has been showing it to her friends. None of them know ANY of it.
Well, I could (and maybe I will) write a book, but motherly duties call and I am faithful to my vocation!!!
So in conclusion, I have watched this for 30 years, and right now the Church in the Albany Diocese is NOT Roman Catholic...I am praying that it will be so again for my grandchildren.

[NYer]

 Has this been tossed around before?

Death from natural causes has been discussed on various threads but, short of the corner's report, no meaningful conclusion was reached.