EPISCOPAL GAYNESS CRUMBLES CHURCH UNITY

private discussion list | 2 November 2003 | J. Grant Swank, Jr.

[soopadoop]

well, yeah, personally i do because i believe it is the work of prejudiced 1st century heterosexuals. but trying to put myself in a religious believers shoes, i would think that if a person loves god, and are not hurting anybody, then they should be allowed to preach. god loves his children, yeah!

[Wrigley]

OK soop, prove that Marlowes last point is a lie.

[Wrigley]

Rom 9:13 As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated.

Rom 9:14 What shall we say then? [Is there] unrighteousness with God? God forbid.

Rom 9:15 For he saith to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion.

Rom 9:16 So then [it is] not of him that willeth, nor of him that runneth, but of God that sheweth mercy.

Rom 9:17 For the scripture saith unto Pharaoh, Even for this same purpose have I raised thee up, that I might shew my power in thee, and that my name might be declared throughout all the earth.

[soopadoop]

well i ask you to disprove any of my points. i will (and here you go with your clever "har har he can't prove it, so it must be false"), admit that i don't have any statistics; but if homosexuals died at fifty, on average, it would be a national epidemic. how do these homosexuals die so young? cos they're generally not getting aids, cos they're practicing safe sex, any attempt to show that they have a higher ratio of STD is false....so...there you go.

if god's up there, he's proud of me for fighting the good fight. stop the persecution of good people.

[drstevej]

*** i would think that if a person loves god, and are not hurting anybody, then they should be allowed to preach.***

His church affirms the authority of the Bible, soopy. There are churches that have no allegiance to the Bible where he could preach his views consistently.

[drstevej]

***if god's up there, he's proud of me for fighting the good fight.***

You better hope God isn 't a Bible believer or you're toast.

[soopadoop]

no, i hope God is good a good God.

[soopadoop]

God is a good God*. should really use the preview thing...

[drstevej]

Good = agrees with soopadoop

[soopadoop]

nah...not necessarily...just realises that the people who preach misunderstanding and the people who actually hurt others are the bad ones...not the ones who were biologically created different...

[RobbyS]

Robinson is already preaching his sexuality. Have you not been listening. It is not his sinning that is the problem buty that he denies, contrary to all authority, that he IS sinning.

[RobbyS]

Is Robinson "biologically" different? As much as people would like to believe this, this can be no more proved than it can be proved that drunks are biologically different from others. Tghe irony is that drunks are expected to reform but homosexuals are not.

[Wrigley]

In 1998, another study, this one in the journal Psychological Reports, used four contemporary databases to conclude that homosexual activity may diminish life expectancy by 20 to 30 years. By comparison, the National Cancer Institute says that cigarette use lops 7 to 10 years from the average smoker's life.

Even before the devastating AIDS epidemic broke on the homosexual scene in the early 1980s, gays' life spans were severely truncated by comparison with the national average. In 1977, the largest survey of homosexuals up to that time reported only 0.2 percent of lesbians and 0.8 percent of gay males were age 65 or older. Also, as long ago as the 1930s and '40s, sex researcher and sex-liberation pioneer Alfred Kinsey reported that less than 1 percent of the homosexuals he studied were over age 65.

source

[soopadoop]

think about what you're saying; if a homosexual partnership is practiced with caution and restraint, then it should be okay. being consistently drunk can harm your social standings and upset the ones you love. reforming will be positive, because you'll be able to drink leisurely or not at all, and live without something which is rotting your body. reforming homosexuals into heterosexuals is, i think, impossible, and not needed.

and to the previous poster, yes, i've already answered this by saying that i don't think it is a sin; i'm rebelling against the hatred more than the actual opinion that scripture shouldn't be changed.

i'm happy to say i'm still very confident that i am biologically fine, not a sinner, and a generally nice guy. i'm unhappy to say that all my responses to your homosexual = bad arguments have fallen on deaf ears, and religion will continue to be contradictory as long as it preaches hate. this has made me feel ill in fact, due to me being one of those effeminate types, so i doubt i'll post too much now. thank you to the people who didn't compare my people to people who take part in non-consensual sex.

[soopadoop]

erm, all your evidence coming from times when there would have been a lot of discrimination of homosexuals. especially the 1930s and 40s one...how many people, in that era, would admit they're homo at that age?

apart from 1998, which i can rebut easily by pointing out the use of the word "may" and the fact that it doesn't cite any actual evidence.

[RobbyS]

Homosexuals do not "do" sex with restraint and caution. Now understand by "homosexual" I do not mean all those persons who may have done such acts, any more than I would say that everyone who has got plastered is a drunk. I mean someone who is "into" the life-style--addicted to it as alcoholics are to booze. As for "hate," well, this is also what I hate about homosexuals: if any interest group is more full of hate for those who oppose them and who would do anything to "bring down"or silence those who dare to say what they do is wrong, or to put it another way, if collectively there is a bigger bunch of pricks, I don't know who they are.

[soopadoop]

no, if i hate you (which fair enough, i do), it's because you make things worse than they are with your philosophy. i'm not trying to silence you. i wouldnt have a chance and you know it*. if you met me and didn't think i was a homosexual, and i didn't know you were a bigot, then you wouldn't think i was a prick. don't insult me please, you have no idea who i am...

*people protesting against homosexuality as the funeral of a homosexual didn't make as big news as any of this, now, did it?

[P-Marlowe]

i hope God is good a good God

No what you are hoping for is an apathetic God. A God who could care less about those who deliberately disobey his commands and refuse to acknowledge his words.

If God is a "Good God," (Good being Holy) then the last words you will say as you gaze upon your eternal home called the lake of fire will be, "GOOD GOD!!!"

I suggest that you consider the fact that God really is Good, and then perhaps you will fear him.

Psa 111:10 The fear of the LORD is the beginning of wisdom: a good understanding have all they that do his commandments: his praise endureth for ever.

[Wrigley]

Did you read the rest of the article? What the author is showing is that diminished lifestyle has always been present in the homosexual lifestyle.

[Credo]

soopadoop Since Nov 2, 2003

I believe we have a disruptor.