We Must Fight the Evil Indians

10-3-03

[vbmoneyspender]

Are you familiar with the treaties that were negotiated with the Indian tribes? Those treaties provide the constitutional basis for the treatment of the tribes. If you need further information on this let me know and I'll dig up some info for you on how treaties work in conjunction with the Constitution.

[Chad Fairbanks]

Here's another interesting perspective, as well...


http://www.usdoj.gov/otj/sovtrb.htm

[tallhappy]

I agree with that. I have my own personal Native American associations myself. I will note, though, that many "Indian" casinos are run by anything but or by people who are 1/32 Native American or whatever, and the actual benefit to the community is largely a mirage. To give those folks special breaks when the business is as profitable as it is already seems a trifle like overkill.

Schwarzenegger's policies address none of these things.

If he were to say the California I immigrated to didn't have Casinos on every corner and we will stop this, then he'd have integrity and get my respect, maybe even my vote.

But nonsensical demagouging about the evil Indians and how he don't play dat game is a joke.

This thread is about how Schwarzenegger does not support core conservative issues -- ones that as governor he has a direct ability to affect.

He will continue to dole out tax dollars for funded abortion, will dole out tax dollars to give benefits to domestic partners, will not return tax dollars to help people send their children to private schools that don't ban God or foist the liberal left agenda on them.

Indian gaming is a red herring. The latter are real issues - conservative vs liberal, right vs left issues and on everyone Schwarzenegger is on the left.

I see no reason to vote for a Republican to implement the left's agenda.

[DoughtyOne]

If they're going to spend $120,000,000.00 over five years to infuence politics in the state, you bet your arse I do.

[tallhappy]

I think what ought to happen is California legalizing gambling for non-Indian groups as well

The absolute worst idea. Yet I think the Schwarzenegger camp will do this or seriously look in to it, if nothing else as their best bargaining chip with the tribes.

I don't want Las Vegas coming to CA. I don't like Indian casinso at all either. We never had them when I was growing up. All we had was the track.

More gambling is not the answer.

[vbmoneyspender]

Here is what the 6th Article of the Constitution says in this regard:

This Constitutioon, and the Laws of the United States which shall be made in Pursuance thereof; and all Treaties made, or which shall be made, under the Authority of the United States, shall be the supreme law of the Land; and the Judges in every State shall be bound thereby, any Thing in the Constitution or Laws of any State to the Contrary notwithstanding.

In interpreting this article of the Constitution, here is what the Supreme Court said when citizens of Switzerland, pursuant to a treaty between the United States and Switzerland, were trying to remove certain monies from the possession of the state of Virginia:

If doubts could exist before the adoption of the present national government, they must be entirely removed by the sixth article of the Constitution, which provides that 'all treaties made or which shall be made under the authority of the United States, shall be the supreme law of the land, and the judges in every State shall be bound thereby, any thing in the Constitution or law of any State to the contrary notwithstanding ... A treaty cannot be the supreme law of the land, that is, of all the United States, if any act of a State legislature can stand in its way. . . It must always be borne in mind that the Constitution, laws, and treaties of the United States are as much a part of the law of every State as its own local laws and Constitution. This is a fundamental principle in our system of complex national polity Hauenstein v. Lynham, 100 U.S. 483 (1880).

[Chad Fairbanks]

And if any other business spends that much, should they also pay into special education and healthcare funds?

[John Jorsett]

I tend to agree that we'd be better off without casinos at all, but the Indian ones are a fact of life, and they're going to spread into the urban areas. Las Vegas type establishments are coming whether we like it or not, so the only question is whether they'll all be Indian owned. If the state wants a cut, the only way it's going to get it is to let non-Indians open them up too.

[Chad Fairbanks]

Also, Article 1 of the Constitution also makes a case for being considered "special" (for want of a better word)

"To regulate commerce with foreign nations, and among the several states, and with the Indian tribes;"

[DoughtyOne]

Chad, other businesses already do.

[sport]

What are you talking about?

Or a better question would be whar have you been smoking, drinking, or ingesting?

If none of the above, are you having a diebetic seizure?

[Chad Fairbanks]

Into special education and healthcare funds? Really? What funds, and how much?

[tallhappy]

I tend to agree that we'd be better off without casinos at all, but the Indian ones are a fact of life

Yes. So let's leave it that way. We do not need to get addicted to Indian gaming money.

It's like the sin tax -- it's self defeating. Tax cigarettes -- more and more epople need to smoke to keep the money coming in. It makes no sense.

[vbmoneyspender]

thanks for that reference

[Chad Fairbanks]

You are welcome...

[tallhappy]

If you were in California you'd know.

See a post above for the hand holding explanation.

[DaughterOfAnIwoJimaVet]

NO ONE thought it out of line...

I did.

[DoughtyOne]

Quit playing the stupid as a rock roll. It's not flattering to you. State businesses pay income taxes to the state which are used to support schools and all other state intrests. The casinos are exempt from that due to the agreements. We've both agree that should be looked at, so let's leave it at that.

[sport]

Thank you. I read it, re-read it, and read it again and still could make heads or tails out of it.
will follow your advice.

[Chad Fairbanks]

OK... makes sense. Now, tell me though - does the state pay for infrastructure on the reservation? Does it pay for schools, healthcare, roads, sewer, power, water, etc... on the reservations? Or do the tribes pay that themselves?

I also seem to notice that the tribes pay for maintenance and upgrading of any state infrastructure that is effected by the casinos.

Based on that, Idont' see how the state has a reasonable claim for the casinos to pay business taxes to the state - the individual tribal members already pay state income taxes.

Maybe we all need for details on this...