Judge Sets Date To End Life Support

The Tampa Tribune ^ | September 18, 2003 | David Sommer

[Robert Drobot]

Is your quote in post 18 a matter of record?

[Robert Drobot]

The questions I've raised have not been answered, nor do I expect them to be answered forthrightly. IMHO the legal tactics have been gutted....from within.

[gracex7]

What are their first names? I'd like to add them to my prayer list.

May the LORD give them strength, endurance and His peace that passes all understanding. And may He also raise up others who will be there to help them.

[jgrubbs]

Call Florida Governor Jeb Bush - 850-488-7146

Call Florida Attorney General Charlie Crist - 850-414-3990

[agrace]

Greer said he sympathized with the parents but concluded that their request to try spoon-feeding her amounts to a bid to litigate the case from scratch.

Nice try. That might hold water if you had EVER ALLOWED THEM TO TRY TO SPOON FEED HER JUST ONCE.

``It is not even a veiled or disguised attempt,'' the judge added.

Neither is your determination to kill her.

[agrace]

Apples and oranges.

[kimmie7]

I'm just now getting around to reading this one, and I can't go into a lot of detail here. I will say...yes, it is an indicator of something in the works. I am of the opinion that it was done for a reason -- yes -- but not necessarily the one you're concerned about. Let me do some more digging and 'talking' . . . do no be too discouraged, my friend. I'm beginning to see a direction in their strategy -- I think. If it's not going in a direction, I'll worry.

[CDHart]

2Ch 19:5And he set judges in the land throughout all the fenced cities of Judah, city by city, 2Ch 19:6 And said to the judges, Take heed what ye do: for ye judge not for man, but for the LORD, who [is] with you in the judgment.

This judge may end up paying dearly for what he is doing.

Carolyn

[jgrubbs]

Because of the prevalence of the negative attitude of the public toward the handicapped, "Parents were made to feel shame and embarrassment at having to raise an abnormal or malformed child" (Proctor, 1992, p. 25). The children's euthanasia program in Germany during the Nazi era is reported to have had its origin in the request by a father of a deformed and retarded child to Hitler to have this child killed. Hitler asked his personal physician to investigate the situation and the child was eventually killed. In 1936-1937, a secret "Reich Committee for the scientific registering of serious hereditary and congenital illnesses" was established in Hitler's Chancellory. This committee of three with medical and psychiatric expertise discussed euthanasia and, in 1939, drafted a prospective law calling for the "destruction of life unworthy of life". This prospective law would have provided legal sanction for "killing people suffering from serious congenital mental or physical 'malformation', because they required long-term care, aroused 'horror' in other people, and were situated on 'the lowest animal level'" (Burleigh, 1994, p. 98).

[TontoKowalski]

After a nonjury trial in January 2000, Greer ruled the evidence showed Terri Schiavo would not want to be kept alive by a feeding tube.

I don't have enough info to comment on this case specifically, and judging from the posts thus far, I don't think my addition to the thread will be very popular... but here goes.

If you're certain you would not like to be kept alive in a vegetative state should anything prevent you from voicing your own desires regarding your medical condition and treatment, then you should make your desires known NOW.

The Living Will is a good way to document your desires, and I'm certain you can get the basic form online. But the best course would be to tell the people closest to you what you want. If Mrs. Schiavo had not wanted to live in this condition, and had she firmly expressed to her husband and parents, then her desires could have been honored, and her family would not be dragged through the emotional and legal struggles they've been through.

The flip side of that coin is that had she wanted to be kept alive at all costs, irregardless of condition and prognosis, she could have expressed that as well. As could any Freeper who wants the opposite of the sentiments expressed in most Living Wills.

[CDHart]

We are seeing the first steps of a very dangerous road, I'm afraid.

Carolyn

[MHGinTN]

I'm wondering, if Florida had law on the books that makes adultery a crime (at least to the level of misdemeanor!), would there be a case for petitioning the court to remove a man from guardianship who is breaking the law, defrauding his legal wife? Is it justice to have a man who is defrauding his disabled wife, yet he is suing to have her executed, to end the defrauding status and increase his wealth? With statutory marriage existing, re the other woman and child, isn't he also a bigamist? Flordia will allow any ol' criminal to be a guardian of a disabled person, eh. [Hey Jeb, you're state is a mockery to civilization, your judges only shells to be manipulated by influential lawyers. It does appear you are impotent to deal with this demented miscarriage of justice. You make a nice figurehead though.]

[hobbes1]

Take the quicker way out.


GO to the Hospital, Say goodbye to your Daughter.

Leave.


Shoot the Husband, Plead Guilty go to jail.Do not Pass Go, Do Not Collect 200$


Minus the Husband, the Only living Relative, to Care for Terry is Mom.

[sockmonkey]

From the testimony of one of Terri's caregivers:

Carla Sauer Iyer was a Licensed Practical Nurse (LPN) at the same convalescent center in the mid 1990s, and also cared for Terri. She described Mr. Schiavo as being "focused on Terri's death.

"Michael [Schiavo] would say, 'When is she going to die? Has she died yet?' and 'When is that bitch going to die?'" Iyer charged. "Other statements which I recall him making include, 'Can't anything be done to accelerate her death, won't she ever die?' When she wouldn't die, Michael [Schiavo] would be furious."

Conversely, Iyer said that when she would have to call Schiavo to inform him of a downturn in Terri's condition, Schiavo would be elated.

"Michael would be visibly excited, thrilled even, hoping that she would die," Iyer recalled. "He would blurt out, 'I'm going to be rich,' and would talk about all the things he would buy when Terri died, which included a new car, a new boat and going to Europe, among other things."

Iyer also described incidents of Terri Schiavo talking, moving voluntarily and responding to external stimuli, descriptions that Iyer said were removed from Mrs. Schiavo's medical records. Both Law and Iyer reported Terri verbally communicating, also contradicting Michael Schiavo's claim that his wife was in a Persistent Vegetative State.

"During the time I cared for Terri, she formed words. I have heard her say 'mommy' from time to time, and 'momma,'" Law recalled. "She also said 'help me' a number of times."

Iyer described Terri as "alert and oriented," and said Michael Schiavo "systematically distorted" Terri's medical condition.

"Terri spoke on a regular basis while in my presence, saying such things as 'mommy' and 'help me,'" Iyer recalled. "'Help me' was, in fact, one of her most frequent utterances. I heard her say it hundreds of times."

---

The thing is that if she was in a persistent vegetative state as her husband portrays her, she wouldn't have been able to talk to speak, would she?

Terri was given spoonfuls of jello by one of her caregivers, and was able to swallow it.

And yes, a living will may be something some folks wish to consider, but in many states, food and water via feeding tube is not considered an extraordinary measure.

[MHGinTN]

If this were my daughter, I'd be thinking along similar lines, but it may well be that the mother isn't able to go this alone without Mr. Schindler. Murder to settle a problem is no solution that God would endorse. Press charges against the bigamist/adulterer and have him removed as guardian ... except that 'killum'Greer would throw the case out since he is obviously protecting this execution as if in a turf war!

[hobbes1]

It would not be murder. It would be justifiable Defense of ones offspring.

[billdcon]

I have to think that a couple thousand motovate people (or a much smaller, well-trained and highly motovated group) could stop this execution.

You know, I don't post a lot - mostly I read and wait...and live my life...and I don't get too worked up about much...I do, however, feel compelled to share some recent events and changes in my life with everyone.

I attend a fairly-liberal Presbyterian church here in San Antonio. I'm actually a deacon to our college folks, and I am very active in the congregation. Some of you might not like the viewpoints of some of our members if you visited our church, but I know this is where the Holy Spriit wants me, and I am learning to see issues I have been dogmatic about in the past from a different perspective. It's been a good experience for me.

Because our church is the way it is, we don't talk a lot about the epic cosmic battle between good and evil :-), and we havn't yet song "Onward Christian Soldiers"...so I was very surprised when our minister, a woman, told this story in church last week:

Some time ago, A white headmaster in a South African school was told by the Board of the school that the school soccer team had to cancel a game they had scheduled against a team from a black school. This took place during the last days of apartheid, and the kind of mixing that this game would have involved would have caused a lot of scorn to come upon the school, its students, and the headmaster himself. When he was told he needed to stop the game from happening, he resigned. This ruined the man, as he was branded as a kaffir-lover by a number of his fellow white professionals.

When asked why he had gotten himself into this situation in the first place, and why he had quit rather than just scrubbing the game, the man said,

"When I die and stand before the Judge of Heaven, I believe he will look at me and ask to see my scars. If I have none to show him, he will ask me 'Was there nothing worth fighting for in your life?'"

My minister's point was: Jesus fought pain, wrath, temptation, Satan, and man himself to bring himself to the cross. He did this because he thought man's Salvation was worth fighting for.

I'm 30 years old. I don't have any scars. Maybe it's time to get a couple.

[kimmie7]

Absolutely beautiful. Welcome to the fray. If you want on the Terri ping list - anyone - please Freepmail me.

[sockmonkey]

*** I'm 30 years old. I don't have any scars. Maybe it's time to get a couple. ***

Welcome, and thanks for your moving post.

There are many anti-death opportunities for the most defenseless in our society in San Antonio. I think Life Chain is coming up next month, but there are other opportunities that happen weekly.

[freeparoundtheclock]

I really believe that Judge Greer is incapacitated. No Judge should characterize any party the way he has characterized Terri's parents. HIS COMMENTS SHOWING SUSPICION OF THEM should be enough to throw him off the case but this is Florida, I keep forgetting. FLORIDA: Don't come here if you're sick and be careful who you marry.

The Judge has had this case waaaaaay too long. There's a timeline in today's st. pete times. Maybe it's at their web site. www.sptimes.com.

I think in Judge Greer's mind, he wants to close this file, he is insulted that the parents are defying his authority. MUST TERRI DIE BECAUSE OF A JUDGE'S EGO and INFLEXIBILITY?

He hasn't ever seen Terri in person. I guess he doesn't want to look in her eyes and see that she's truly alive. That would RUIN HIS CASE FILE.

kimmie7 has a TERRI PING LIST. Please contact her if you want to join it. It's turning into Terri's Freepers.