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To: punster
Well, without the evidence you're basing your premature conclusions upon, you might as well go out the rest of the way on that limb and say that ALL delusions have a physical cause, and we could prove it if we juist had enough dead brains to examine.

You're also going to have to prove that the changes were there from birth and not caused later by some other factor. That means examining the brain at birth. And if a baby doesn't grow up, it can't grow up to declare it's trapped in the wrong body.

Perhaps imaging will improve to the point where we don't need people to die befiore we can check out their brains, eh? And what will you say when it is proven that some of the most obstinate and flaming "I'm really a woman, REALLY, yoiu'd better treat me like one or I'll #@$%ing sue!" types are proven to be male, only male, nothing but male, in their brains as well as their bodies, and they only want an abnormal amount of attention?

In any case, it seems that if you are right, it's a birth defect just like any other birth defect, and should be cured prenatally instead of encouraged postnatally.



57 posted on 09/07/2003 11:13:50 AM PDT by hellinahandcart
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To: hellinahandcart
"Well, without the evidence you're basing your premature conclusions upon, you might as well go out the rest of the way on that limb and say that ALL delusions have a physical cause, and we could prove it if we juist had enough dead brains to examine.

Thre is evidence schizophrenia has a physical cause. Depression also has a physical cause.

"You're also going to have to prove that the changes were there from birth and not caused later by some other factor. That means examining the brain at birth. And if a baby doesn't grow up, it can't grow up to declare it's trapped in the wrong body."

Estrogens and androgen blocking drugs have been administered to adult men in the treatment of prostate cancer, and they do not produce changes in the brain structure. The structure of the brain is complete at birth, since all the neurons a person has are there at birth. Certainly, training helps to develop skills, but it will not develop ones, for which the basic capacity did not exist.

"In any case, it seems that if you are right, it's a birth defect just like any other birth defect, and should be cured prenatally instead of encouraged postnatally."

It is true that we should work to prevent iatrogenic birth defects. That means not administering potent hormones or other drugs known to cause birth defects to pregnant women (examples: thalidomide; cyproterone acetate; spironolactone; Premarin; birth control pills; propecia; etc.) However, as long as the fetus is carried to term in the mother's womb, there is little way to exercise total control over the environment to which the fetus is exposed.

If it is a birth defect, are we to abort the fetus's on the grounds they will have a gender identity problem? Or tell the individuals they are crazy, and wait for them to commit suicide?
62 posted on 09/07/2003 5:28:52 PM PDT by punster
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To: hellinahandcart; punster
Re XX fetuses, the "cure" would be abstinence throughout pregnancy (presumably you can grasp what the primary source of in utero testosterone is). Not sure if any research backs up the notion that the opposite would work for XY fetuses. But at any rate, I'm skeptical that any significant percentage of pregnant couples would be willing to stick to such programs.
92 posted on 09/08/2003 9:51:08 AM PDT by GovernmentShrinker
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