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To: Kenny Bunk
It strikes me (no pun intended) that an RPG HE would definitely take out the wheels on the Stryker. It also would be hard to miss, since there are so many of them. But what I am wondering is how the Stryker armor would stand up to a hit from the HESH RPG, or even how it might fare against HMG fire.

Because the Stryker has a Central Tire Inflation System to allow its height to be lowered for C130 transport, the Stryker tires have to have very thin sidewalls; not only can they be chewed off by small arms fire and deflated with a hit from anything .50 caliber and above [including 12-gauge shotgun slugs, interestingly] they're particularly susceptable to hits from 40mm grenades from weapons such as the underbarrel M203 grenade launcher with High Explosive Dual-Purpose ammunition [a shaped charge warhead that can defeat up to four inches of armor] the Mk 19 automatic grenade launcher, or the Soviet fielded 40mm GP-30 underbarrel launcher for the AK system or the Soviet-designed Plamya beltfed autocannon. And once the tires begin burning, the crew inside can either stay inside and burn with it- the Stryker has a fuel tank mounted externally behind the third and last drive wheels, and it too can be ruptured by small arms or grenade launcher fire- or can leave the *protection* of their vehicle for the waiting shooters outside. Not pretty.

Btw, the PG-7 warhead of the RPG-7D and RPG-7V is a HEAT warhead, not HESH, though the various later thermobaric warhead rounds for the RPG developed by the Russians and Bulgarians can be expected to have an effect similar to that of a HESH round. And the Stryker's armor, necessarily brittle to obtrain hardness, has been fractured when a demolition charge carried externally on an engineer vehicle configured Stryker detonated during live fire testing. Accordingly, it appears likely that the Stryker will be particularly vulnerable to such projectiles and will need anti-spall linings...more weight to go with the additional 2 tons from the add-on armor; it's now over 20 tons. And that means even less room inside, too...

It's not much better for those aboard a tracked vehicle when a track is knocked off or apart than it is for those on wheels, but some tracks can at least roll away on their road wheels out of the kill zone, particularly if on a paved road or city street.

In an urban scenario, wouldn't there be fire from behind and above, as well? It looks to me that a Dingo type vehicle might be just as effective as the Stryker and a lot handier (and cheaper!) I frankly would hate to ride either one into an hostile alley.

Probably the real most recent experts on the use of armored vehicles in urban areas was the Brits during the time of their occupation of Northern Ireland. They required an enormous variety of differing types, both wheeled and tracked, and they also faced the RPG-7 and similar launchers, though not in as great a number as our forces may encounter. Everything from armoured Land Rovers to six-wheeled armoured cars mounting a 76mm main gun were used, as well as light 4-wheel armoured cars and armored police *paddy wagons.* Rifle fire and Molotov cocktails were the primary concerns, though not at all the only ones.

In addition to the Dingo, check out the six-wheeled Finnish Sisu, similar, but superior in many ways.

The point, though, is that when you do find yourself rolling into a hornets nest in a blind alley [or a crossroads where you may be in an X-shaped ambush taking fire from all sides] you roll right out again if you can. And you think a lot about command-detonated mines while you're doing so, as well as backup RPGs.

I'm getting the picture that in urban warfare, the best transportation is sneakers, the best weapons: RPGs, scoped sniper rifles (day and night), and AK74s. All of which favor the homies, and not the visiting team. Perhaps we ought to do what we do best, and make sure potential enemies do not have any urban areas left. That's what these vehicles are apparently best suited for: sitting on a hillside 2 miles away, watching the AF reorganize hostile urban areas and the Army smooth out the rubble with artillery. IMHO, the best weapons aboard a Stryker are its radios and and digital C3 gear and a laser target designator. But the point is, that if you're facing a determined enemy mounted on those sneakers, with RPG-7s [or worse; there ARE more effective handheld AT weapons] SVD snipers' rifles and AKs, you need troops on the ground on foot to deal with them, NOT riding around in vehicles....though fast response teams will be required, as they were in Mogadishu when the Rangers were slaughtered.

But those response teams had better be expecting to be suckered into an ambush. Because a strike on an isolated patrol is how such forces are pulled out of their defensive perimeters to a nice location where forces thought to be sufficient to deal with them will be waiting.

The accompanying vehicles support the grunts on the ground; they're not just a taxi for them. When we forget that, we'll pay.

18 posted on 09/06/2003 9:42:10 AM PDT by archy (Keep in mind that the milk of human kindness comes from a beast that is both cannibal and a vampire.)
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To: archy
Central Tire Inflation System

The CTIS has nothing to do with the height management system. Two toatally different systems. I may not be a Stryker fan, but we need to have the facts straight.

28 posted on 09/06/2003 9:15:58 PM PDT by SLB
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