Free trade's victims turning against Bush, GOP

The Herald Sun ^ | August 25, 2003 | associated press

[Malsua]

>>Make up your mind. Which is it? Am I the problem or are you? <<

You are. I'm simply exploiting the situation as I can.

You're supporting the greater bad. You think we can continue on this course forever.

>>Personally, I understand economics a little better than you<<

Sure you do. I bow to your infinite wisdom. Lol.

I'm part of an internation corporation and I deal with products shipping all over the globe.

China is only part of the problem. Many products come from Malaysia, Thailand, Singapore, India and elsewhere. I deal with this every day. I'm guessing you've never even been to Asia. I guess that means though, you know more about it than me. Uncle, Uncle. You win. LOL.

I've got a job for you. I'll pay you $20 Hong Kong Dollars to drive a truck into the mainland. That's the going rate for drivers by the way. Now, when you learn that the truck is filled with products made in the USA, will you take the job? No? Why? Not enough money? Ok, assume I'll give you $2000 USD to do it? Would you? Please? Wanna know why i'd offer that? Chances are you'll be detained at the border and your passport will be siezed for about 2 weeks. This is standard practice for ANYTHING going into China.

Course, the flip flop of that, going out, get's a wave and off it goes. Until you are part of that process, you simply WILL NOT UNDERSTAND that the rest of the world does NOT deal fairly with the USA. You are the problem.

[null and void]

Want to bet me on it?

Nope. I never bet more than I'm willing to lose. Besides, I hope he wins.

[bluejay]

Texas_Dawg wrote:

"So we're not all doomed?"

Probably not until 2008...

[Texas_Dawg]

I've got a job for you. I'll pay you $20 Hong Kong Dollars to drive a truck into the mainland. That's the going rate for drivers by the way. Now, when you learn that the truck is filled with products made in the USA, will you take the job? No? Why? Not enough money? Ok, assume I'll give you $2000 USD to do it? Would you? Please? Wanna know why i'd offer that? Chances are you'll be detained at the border and your passport will be siezed for about 2 weeks. This is standard practice for ANYTHING going into China.

I missed the part where you, as an American, are legally required to work with China.

[null and void]

I predict that what Bush will do is wait for a Republican of some kind to get into California and bail-out California right before the election ---- if $15 billion can be thrown at African AIDS, certainly there is $35 billion or so around to throw at California. With those electoral votes, he doesn't have to worry about a few other minor states like Florida.

Works for me! IF, and it's a big IF, California isn't already too far gone. "Cupping the dead"...

[Poohbah]

I'll give you a Buchanan Brigade hint: These "merchants" often have big noses and often need the blood of Gentile children for certain religious rituals of theirs.

Second Danbury Baptist Church of Elvis the Holy Redeemer, Reformed?

[thtr]

I have read your 14 point plan a number of times on different threads on this subject and for the most part I am in agreement. There is a point however that I am less confident in supporting and that is #5 (reducing corporate income tax to zero in return for “buy American “/ “hire American”. I do not think that this particular point focuses on the problem of exporting American jobs and carries with it a few unseen problems.

Firstly, small businesses that have little or nothing to do with exporting jobs overseas will indeed flock to this idea. We would see a drastic move from C corporations to fully incorporated because it would be a gigantic tax break with having to give up very little. Unless accompanied with discretionary spending cuts, this just adds to the tax burden of the personal income taxpayer and does little or nothing to solve the problem.

Secondly, corporations which deal with direct services or corporations that have little or no overseas market would also flock to this plan as it is a nice tax break. However since these corporations have little or nothing to do with the problem it is just a tax break that (without spending cuts) is just shifted to the personal income taxpayer.

Thirdly, those corporations that do export labor may not see this as an enticement to stop. Each would have to weigh the net profit of “buy America / hire America against whatever they pay in corporate income tax. Many of these companies (primarily due to breaks given by congress since 1986) pay a small percentage of their real profit on federal corporate tax. Small businesses (C corporations) carry a much larger load, both in numbers and amount).

I would love to see corporate income tax reduced. However, I would also like to see personal income tax reduced. I am a little hesitant to favor any change that would lower one to the detriment of raising the other.

[null and void]

Anytown has a name. It's Silicon Valley...

[Texas_Dawg]

Merchants have no country. The mere spot they stand on does not constitute so strong an attachment as that from which they draw their gains.

I just want to highlight this quote one more time for all the Buchanan Brigaders on this thread who think we evil "RINOs" are being unfair in our claims of what is really deep down beneath a lot of the rantings on trade that he and his crowd vomit.

"Merchants"? So that's what we're calling them now? Classic.

[Texas_Dawg]

Second Danbury Baptist Church of Elvis the Holy Redeemer, Reformed?

Yes. Exactly. :-)

[Mad Dawgg]

"I'll give you a Buchanan Brigade hint: These "merchants" often have big noses and often need the blood of Gentile children for certain religious rituals of theirs."

Jehovah’s Witnesses?

[Texas_Dawg]

And just for the sake of disclosure, not that it matters, but I'm not a "Merchant".

[WRhine]

It's something both radical feminists and radical free traders don't address. What about the american family? Are your free trade ideals worth more than the family?

To some here it apparently is. The thing that astonishes me is that I have yet to come across a "free trade" advocate that talks about the NECESSITY of opening up markets to OUR goods and services. It's like they don't care that many of our so-called trading partners follow the very thing they proclaim to hate i.e. "protectionism" and “mercantilist trade practices” that create huge lopsided trade deficits with America.

About the best they can do on that front is to say, laughably, that those countries are doing us a favor while hurting themselves. Yeah Riigghhht.

Given that reasoning I supposed if they were mugged they would say it was a mutually beneficial experience.

[Texas_Dawg]

Jehovah’s Witnesses?

Yes. And Hare Krishnas.

[Mad Dawgg]

'And just for the sake of disclosure, not that it matters, but I'm not a "Merchant".'

But... do you play one on TV?

[Junior_G]

And just for the sake of disclosure, not that it matters, but I'm not a "Merchant".

Not that it matters, indeed. God forbid anyone should ever mistake T-Dawg for a "merchant".

[Malsua]

>>I missed the part<<

You certainly did.

You completely MISS that the USA doesn't have open markets to sell ANYWHERE yet the rest of the world can openly sell in the USA and exploit our market.

Game, Set, Match. YOU LOSE.

[Texas_Dawg]

But... do you play one on TV?

Of course. Don't you know all Merchants run TV and the media?

[Mad Dawgg]

'Not that it matters, indeed. God forbid anyone should ever mistake T-Dawg for a "merchant".'

Heh, what is really hilarious is that I am a voting member of our Downtown area's "Merchant" League.