Backers guard Ten Commandments monument

AP | 8/22/03 | BOB JOHNSON

[kattracks]

MONTGOMERY, Ala. (AP) — About 40 supporters of an Alabama judge's Ten Commandments monument stood watch over it early Friday, hoping to keep anyone from removing it from the rotunda of the state judicial building.

Chief Justice Roy Moore went home after spending much of Thursday vowing to do everything within his power to keep the monument in place. His eight colleagues on the state Supreme Court had ordered the monument taken out early in the day after a federal judge's midnight removal deadline passed.

Moore's supporters kept vigil Friday morning from their sleeping bags and bedrolls strewn across the rotunda floor.

The Rev. Herman Henderson of Believers' Tabernacle in Birmingham opted to nap on the concrete with his head resting on sheet music for the song, "I Shall Not Be Moved."

They remained quiet throughout the night, prompting police to retreat to their post across the street.

U.S. District Judge Myron Thompson set the midnight deadline after deciding that sitting in the public rotunda, the monument violated the Constitution's ban on government promotion of a religious doctrine. Thompson has said it could be moved to a private place still within the building.

The judge had threatened $5,000-a-day fines if Moore left the monument in the rotunda.

Building manager Graham George was instructed by the state's high court to "take all steps necessary to comply" with the removal order, justice Gorman Houston said. George declined to comment when asked when, how or where the monument would be moved.

Moore condemned his fellow judges for their orders. In their ruling, the Alabama justices stated they were "bound by solemn oath" to uphold the law.

"I will never deny the God upon whom our laws and country depend," Moore said Thursday in defending the 5,300-pound granite marker, which he installed two years ago and contends is representation of the moral foundation of American law.

"Not only did Judge Thompson put himself above the law, but above God as well," Moore told supporters.

The chief justice had appealed to the U.S. Supreme Court for an emergency stay of the removal order, but the court rejected it Wednesday. Moore said Thursday he would file a formal appeal with the high court soon "to defend our constitutional right to acknowledge God."

"I cannot forsake my conscience," he said.

Richard Cohen, an attorney for the Southern Poverty Law Center — which sued along with the American Civil Liberties Union and Americans United for Separation of Church and State — praised the eight justices.

"Their courageous actions reflect that Justice Moore is a disgrace to the bench and ought to resign or be removed from office," Cohen said.

Still, protesters outside the building said they were willing to stand in the heat and risk arrest for days or weeks to keep the monument inside. Twenty-one were arrested Wednesday night on trespassing charges.

Stephen Hopkins, pastor of Burnet Bible Church in Burnet, Texas, was one of those arrested. He said he was willing to be arrested even though he has 10 children.

"This is a great hypocrisy," Hopkins said. "This is an assault on God. They're saying we're going to cover up God."

[Maelstrom]

People kneel and pray in front of altars in church.
They aren't worshipping those altars.

People kneel and pray at the side of their beds.
They aren't worshipping those beds.

Shocking isn't it?

The "pastor's" claim that covering itup is covering up God is an identification of the problem I outlined: Censorship.

You of course have no problem with prohibiting worship, nor with censorship. You've always been a statist.

[Chancellor Palpatine]

Why would an altar be located at a courthouse?

[Maelstrom]

No, you're seeking a more Communist state within the US.

This begins with the censorship of religion.

That you support many policies that inevitably lead to tyranny classes you clearly as an authoritarian or statist is no secret. I wouldn't go so far as to say that you are actually a card-carrying Communist.

One of communism's first tenets is to remove religion from the daily lives of the citizens...and you're certainly attempting to help them along.

[Maelstrom]

Not quite...when he was sworn into office...as all the other Justices were...he took an Oath on a Bible to God swearing to uphold the Constitution and defend it.

[Maelstrom]

It's not an altar.

[Texas_Dawg]

Now I'm a communist, it seems.

Hey, who isn't?

[OXENinFLA]

They can't keep the State Constitution and get rid of the tablets. What they're counting on is that we/you the people don't know what's in your State Constitution. They're using your ignorance against you. Get educated and read it. Then you'll see why this judge is fighting their actions, and why their actions are illegal.

Well put.

[Maelstrom]

What action has he taken to prevent it?

As I recall...Athena from the Roman Pantheon is already prominently displayed.

I suppose that's All Right because that goddess follows the Roman Pantheonic theme rather than a Biblical one.

[Texas_Dawg]

That you support many policies that inevitably lead to tyranny classes you clearly as an authoritarian or statist is no secret. I wouldn't go so far as to say that you are actually a card-carrying Communist.

Have you ever been to a Communist country? I work with underground churches in Cuba and have friends doing the same in China. We don't get to break the law (well, American ones that is) and go on CNN every day to celebrate ourselves.

[Maelstrom]

No law was broken.

[Texas_Dawg]

No law was broken.

So I guess they were dragging people off to jail for fun. Or are Alabama state troopers all evil heathen Communists now too?

[Maelstrom]

It's every bit a religious symbol as the 10 Commandments.

It simply doesn't have as many adherents.

The differences between the two is their themes: One is from the Roman Patheon, this one is Biblical. One is currently being persecuted, the other is merely considered "art".

The fact is, they're both art of equal gravity.

[Maelstrom]

"Congress shall make no law..."

Congress made no law that is Constitutional pertinent to the display.

No, they weren't dragging people off to jail for fun. It's part and parcel of the persecution of Judeo-Christianity due to the objections of those people against the unconstitutional censorship of an entire class of religions which use the Bible.

[Maelstrom]

Yes, I've been to a Communist country.

That's one of the reasons I'm shocked at how willing people here are for accepting the foundations of it in this country.


HOW DARE YOU HELP IT GAIN GROUND HERE AT HOME!

[Texas_Dawg]

HOW DARE YOU HELP IT GAIN GROUND HERE AT HOME!

Let's say this monument is kept in place (I supported attempts to keep it there and disagree with the court's ruling)... how many lives have you brought to Christ through it?

Let's say it's removed. How many lives are less able to hear the Gospel because of that?

If you've followed this thread or others that I've participated in, you'll notice that while some of these people supporting Moore may be more "conservative" (that's debatable), very few of them are professing Christians.

[mhking]

I was supporting Moore until I found out yesterday that he HIMSELF put that monument there, anticipating this very bit of attention he's getting.

The Ten Commandments and what they represent is no different than the other historical documents that signified "the law" to people of all time, but that is all that it signifies in this case. Moore, in his infinite wisdom, decided to elevate create this "constitutional crisis" by putting the monument there in the first place.

He knew what kind of mess it would cause, and we're stuck having to deal with it.

I'm a Christian and proud of it. I have no problem with the Commandments being honored; I've got no quarrel with the frieze of Moses or Jesus on the Supreme Court building in Washington. But let's put it this way. If Moore were Amerindian and put a sacred relic which signified an ancestral lawgiver on display the same way in the same place, most of the folks here would have no problem with taking it down.

What's good for the goose is good for the gander. The only way that Moore should be permitted to retain the monument, is if those of other faiths were permitted to put equal representations of their laws in the same area.

I don't think Moore would be open to that, though.

[donning asbestos suit]

[Texas_Dawg]

No, they weren't dragging people off to jail for fun. It's part and parcel of the persecution of Judeo-Christianity due to the objections of those people against the unconstitutional censorship of an entire class of religions which use the Bible.

You don't think it's possible that there might be just one Alabama State Trooper who accepts Jesus Christ as his Lord and Saviour? Would he be a Communist for arresting the people breaking the law?

[Maelstrom]

The monument is a work of art.

Why would it bring Christ to anyone? That isn't it's purpose.

Removing it establishes the precedent that Free Speech does not apply to Christians. It establishes the precedent that religion can be prohibitted on public property.

Most people recognize the dual threats of censorship and prohibitions against religion. Moore is just a fallible man, the principles he is upholding in this instance are correct for the reasons I've stated. Moore doesn't lead this movement, he only allowed it to happen. Moore didn't pay for that statue, he only helped place it in the courthouse rotunda via his permission.

His action is more like Rosa Parks than Jim Jones. Recognize it and be glad.