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To: GOPcapitalist
Somebody posted this the other day but only a partial article over here. Same article, same response

Viewed in this way, one can say that the historical task and political purpose of neoconservatism would seem to be this: to convert the Republican party, and American conservatism in general, against their respective wills, into a new kind of conservative politics suitable to governing a modern democracy.

How is anything in the neocon playbook conservative? More government, interfering in world situations that have nothing to do with the safety of this nation, spending on the level that would make FDR and LBJ balk?

Neoconservatism is the first variant of American conservatism in the past century that is in the "American grain." It is hopeful, not lugubrious; forward-looking, not nostalgic; and its general tone is cheerful, not grim or dyspeptic. Its 20th-century heroes tend to be TR, FDR, and Ronald Reagan.

Forgot one. Wilson. Without him we may have never had a neoconservative movement. At least not one involving foreign policy. Or else it would have been quickly relegated to the trashpile where it belongs

AND THEN, of course, there is foreign policy, the area of American politics where neoconservatism has recently been the focus of media attention. This is surprising since there is no set of neoconservative beliefs concerning foreign policy, only a set of attitudes derived from historical experience.

That has to be the most ridiculous thing I've read today. No set of beliefs? From 'liberating the masses' to 'spreading democracy' I'm beginning to wonder when they'll have time to defend this nation of states.

(The favorite neoconservative text on foreign affairs, thanks to professors Leo Strauss of Chicago and Donald Kagan of Yale, is Thucydides on the Peloponnesian War.)

Well at least he admits it

These attitudes can be summarized in the following "theses" (as a Marxist would say): First, patriotism is a natural and healthy sentiment and should be encouraged by both private and public institutions. Precisely because we are a nation of immigrants, this is a powerful American sentiment. Second, world government is a terrible idea since it can lead to world tyranny. International institutions that point to an ultimate world government should be regarded with the deepest suspicion.

Well unless it's under the 'right' leadership, eh Irving?

Of course, the United States must be prudent in how it exercises its power. But we cannot safely avoid the responsibilities of global leadership or the costs that are associated with its exercise. America has a vital role in maintaining peace and security in Europe, Asia, and the Middle East.
PNAC Statement of Principles
43 posted on 08/17/2003 9:31:36 PM PDT by billbears (Deo Vindice)
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To: billbears
These attitudes can be summarized in the following "theses" (as a Marxist would say): First, patriotism is a natural and healthy sentiment and should be encouraged by both private and public institutions.

In the words of the great satirist Ambrose Bierce:

"PATRIOTISM, n. Combustible rubbish read to the torch of any one ambitious to illuminate his name. In Dr. Johnson's famous dictionary patriotism is defined as the last resort of a scoundrel. With all due respect to an enlightened but inferior lexicographer I beg to submit that it is the first."

He had Irving pinged dead on.

44 posted on 08/17/2003 9:45:29 PM PDT by GOPcapitalist
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To: billbears
There is a difference between being a hegemon in an alliance and leading a world government.
45 posted on 08/17/2003 10:25:39 PM PDT by rmlew ("Millions for defense, but not one cent for tribute.")
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To: billbears
What ruined "Conservatism" and made the way possible for "Neoconservatism" was the irresponsible anti war and anti military rhetoric of the "New Left" that came of age in 60's and was motivated primarily by the Viet Nam war.

The "New Left" so over it did it with their love of Communism in Viet Nam and then in Cambodia and their disgusting hate filled screeds about American Servicemen that they made "militersim" a "conservative" position. Thus- somehow- it is "conservative" to blindly support the military and the President. It is "conservative" to never question our foreign policy and only "left wingers" do that anyway.

Neoconservatism is not conservative in any sense. It is perpetual war or "creative destruction" as Michael Leeden likes to say in his fevered screeds.

That younger college type Republicans think being "conservative" is wearing a Bush T-shirt depresses me.

49 posted on 08/17/2003 11:20:48 PM PDT by Burkeman1 ((If you see ten troubles comin down the road, Nine will run into the ditch before they reach you.))
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