[Dominic Harr]

As a favor to me and every other FR IT guy.... can you put them down and submit them as a message?

Boy, that would take a novel.

I'll give you the current one we're battling now. We outsourced our Lotus Notes development to a group called 'Satiam' in India. They were given a project, writing a 'log tracking' app. Our folks estimated it would take our people 1500 hours, beginning to end. The indians estimated 2000 hours, so that's what we budgeted for.

The indian folks have now burned thru the entire budget, and have not yet had a design doc approved. They're asking for 1500 more hours to finish the 'requirements gathering'.

If you want this to end, get to a reporter somewhere and just have him look into the results from all this. I've not been able to find one single success story. As far as I can tell, it's a 100% failure rate.

Sure, the indians *fail* cheaper than we do, but is that really a good thing?

[Lazamataz]

Okay, that's a good one. Can you detail your last outsource project besides that one? (I'll gather your words and put up a post after a few of these)

[Lazamataz]

Lets do some math:

Your folks estimated it would take our people 1500 hours, beginning to end. The indians estimated 2000 hours. They have now burned thru the entire budget, and have not yet had a design doc approved. They're asking for 1500 more hours to finish the 'requirements gathering'.

Your folks would have done it -- front to finish -- in 1500 hours at 75,000/annum or $36/hr, at a total of $54,086.

The Indians work cheaper, at 15,000/annum, or $7.21/hr. They have already asked for 3500, JUST ON REQUIREMENTS GATHERING. Call coding another 3000 and support/deployment/bug fixes another 3500. Thats 10000 at $7.21, or $72,100.

Let's see: Americans get it done at $54,086. Indians get it done at $72,100.

Oh, yes, we must select the Indians.

[stylin19a]

I think it's spelled Satyam. How do I know ? I had to train them for what I do (I didn't train them for what I know). Had I been an employee, I would have quit rather than train them, however, I work for a consulting firm. We have other clients and we have products...so I'm safe for today. ( In consulting, it's here today gone today).

Interesting thing......the 2nd in command for Satyam on this particluar client's site opined that they weren't ready to take over. He was summarily fired..then rehired as a programmer.

Near as I can figure, the difference between us(we designed and developed the system)and Satyam... is the difference between a teacher and a baby sitter.

The only thing I see here, is an opportunity to make big bucks cleaning up their mess.