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When Time Erases Written Languages
Salt Lake Tribune ^ | 8-7-2003 | Greg Lavine

Posted on 08/07/2003 4:19:19 PM PDT by blam

When time erases written languages

By Greg Lavine
The Salt Lake Tribune

While researchers periodically hail new finds as the earliest examples of human writing, few scientists have systematically peered into the other end of the process -- the fall of a culture's written symbols. Writing systems, like cultures, have come and gone throughout human history. Brigham Young University anthropologist Stephen Houston and other colleagues studied several dead script systems from around the globe to look for similarities and differences in their respective demises. "What's interesting is why people choose, or are forced, to drop something that had been enormously important to their society," Houston said from his current field site in Guatemala. "This is an enormous step. And since it is such a big shift, it points to even larger changes in the societies that use and transmit such forms of writing." These reasons can range from the arrival of a conquering civilization to limiting a system's use to a narrow band of users. Researchers from BYU, Oxford University in England and Johns Hopkins University in Baltimore put forth their findings in a recent edition of the journal Comparative Studies in Society and History. Mayan, Egyptian and Mesopotamian writing systems were examined as part of the study. "The disappearance of writing systems is a significant gauge of the end of a civilization, but the two do not coincide neatly and writing systems show amazing persistence, which is a sign of their cultural importance," said John Baines, an Egyptology researcher at Oxford University. Among the factors that set up a culture's script for trouble was a small pool of people trained to write, Houston explained. Some writing systems were used mainly for government or religious reasons. In the societies examined in the study, those individuals able to read and write were often members of the aristocracy or specially trained workers, such as scribes. If a particular government or religion fell, the related script system generally collapsed as well. If a wider swath of society can use written scripts, for tasks such as writing letters and keeping records, the system has a better chance of surviving cultural upheaval, he said. The Mayans faced their biggest challenge when the Spanish swept through and took over their ancestral homelands. Houston, who focused on the Mayan part of the study, drew from some 10,000 hieroglyphic texts. "The Spaniards found the hieroglyphs 'obnoxious' and actively discouraged their use," Houston said of the fall of the Mayan writing system. Egyptian hieroglyphs eventually met a similar fate once the Romans took control of the region about 30 B.C., he said. "With Egyptian, the hieroglyphs became too closely associated with a religion that the state no longer wants to sponsor," he said. Baines noted that Egyptian writing did manage to survive, at least in some form, through various occupations, including the Roman Empire. The latest Egyptian text was written in 450, well past ancient Egypt's glory days, Baines said. While it is possible that the letters on this page will someday appear as a jumble of squiggles to future readers, the modern alphabet appears to have some staying power. "The alphabet doesn't have the same cultural and religious associations of the other writing systems," Houston said. "It is deliberately 'general' and will remain so."


TOPICS: News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: erases; languages; time; written

1 posted on 08/07/2003 4:19:20 PM PDT by blam
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To: blam
(Sorry about the format)

While researchers periodically hail new finds as the earliest examples of human writing, few scientists have systematically peered into the other end of the process -- the fall of a culture's written symbols.

Writing systems, like cultures, have come and gone throughout human history. Brigham Young University anthropologist Stephen Houston and other colleagues studied several dead script systems from around the globe to look for similarities and differences in their respective demises.

"What's interesting is why people choose, or are forced, to drop something that had been enormously important to their society," Houston said from his current field site in Guatemala. "This is an enormous step. And since it is such a big shift, it points to even larger changes in the societies that use and transmit such forms of writing."

These reasons can range from the arrival of a conquering civilization to limiting a system's use to a narrow band of users.

Researchers from BYU, Oxford University in England and Johns Hopkins University in Baltimore put forth their findings in a recent edition of the journal Comparative Studies in Society and History. Mayan, Egyptian and Mesopotamian writing systems were examined as part of the study.

"The disappearance of writing systems is a significant gauge of the end of a civilization, but the two do not coincide neatly and writing systems show amazing persistence, which is a sign of their cultural importance," said John Baines, an Egyptology researcher at Oxford University.

Among the factors that set up a culture's script for trouble was a small pool of people trained to write, Houston explained. Some writing systems were used mainly for government or religious reasons. In the societies examined in the study, those individuals able to read and write were often members of the aristocracy or specially trained workers, such as scribes. If a particular government or religion fell, the related script system generally collapsed as well.

If a wider swath of society can use written scripts, for tasks such as writing letters and keeping records, the system has a better chance of surviving cultural upheaval, he said.

The Mayans faced their biggest challenge when the Spanish swept through and took over their ancestral homelands.

Houston, who focused on the Mayan part of the study, drew from some 10,000 hieroglyphic texts. "The Spaniards found the hieroglyphs 'obnoxious' and actively discouraged their use," Houston said of the fall of the Mayan writing system.

Egyptian hieroglyphs eventually met a similar fate once the Romans took control of the region about 30 B.C., he said.

"With Egyptian, the hieroglyphs became too closely associated with a religion that the state no longer wants to sponsor," he said.

Baines noted that Egyptian writing did manage to survive, at least in some form, through various occupations, including the Roman Empire. The latest Egyptian text was written in 450, well past ancient Egypt's glory days, Baines said.

While it is possible that the letters on this page will someday appear as a jumble of squiggles to future readers, the modern alphabet appears to have some staying power. "The alphabet doesn't have the same cultural and religious associations of the other writing systems," Houston said. "It is deliberately 'general' and will remain so."

2 posted on 08/07/2003 4:21:47 PM PDT by blam
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To: blam
Books are going away, newspapers, too. The cam-phone is here, as is TV and radio news. Writing will soon be back where it started, in the hands of merchants and lawyers. It won't take long, a generation or two, English will be the only active language on earth, and it won't be the English we know today.
3 posted on 08/07/2003 4:28:51 PM PDT by RightWhale (Destroy the dark; restore the light)
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To: RightWhale
Read the back pages of 1984 regarding "newspeak". I don't think the written word will go away. Remember how computers were supposed to eliminate typing? Now its just called keyboarding.

Language could go to gutterspeak like bladerunner. (the original not the bad "director's cut")

Perhaps general populace will be more like Farenheit 451?

How about Demolition man, the utopian nightmare world of a 40 year old virgin stuggling with whether to have the advocado or pinapple milkshak?

waaaaay to many books and movies in my head.

4 posted on 08/07/2003 4:53:08 PM PDT by longtermmemmory (Vote!)
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To: blam
Dude. Thank you for posting this.
5 posted on 08/07/2003 5:03:08 PM PDT by Asclepius (karma vigilante)
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To: longtermmemmory
FreeRepublic is far above average, but 50,000 lurkers and 3,000 part-time posters can't hold off the forces of barbarism forever. The adjacent thread is "One third of Massachusetts teachers failed English test," hardly a favorable omen.

6 posted on 08/07/2003 5:10:30 PM PDT by RightWhale (Destroy the dark; restore the light)
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To: RightWhale
Have you ever tried reading the 1215AD Magna Carta, written in English? For us normal (2003AD) English readers, it's impossible.
7 posted on 08/07/2003 5:20:45 PM PDT by blam
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To: blam
Not recently. I am working on a few older languages in a variety of fonts. I find that English is the same language as the old, if you allow for a few changes such as gobbling up local dialects here and there over time and in different geographical regions. English has grown in size if not in clarity due to this diet. Once Chinese has been digested, the game will be about over. Can't say that English will be written using the Roman alphabet everywhere any more than Sanskrit uses a single font or even a set of similar fonts. In common usage, English will have to be only spoken, voicemail files, eventually, and records will not be English at all, nothing but names and numbers in the spreadsheets.
8 posted on 08/07/2003 5:40:45 PM PDT by RightWhale (Destroy the dark; restore the light)
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To: blam
The tittle is my favorite part of the alphabet. It is a symbol of accuracy and completeness.
9 posted on 08/07/2003 5:50:55 PM PDT by Consort
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To: RightWhale
Spanglish, some futurists say, will be the language of the United States and therefore a good chunk of the world.
10 posted on 08/07/2003 5:56:41 PM PDT by Chuckster ("If honor were profitable, everybody would be honorable." Thomas More)
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To: blam
I always though it was in Latin, like:

"Johannes del gracia rex Anglie, dominus Hibernie, dux Normannie, Aquitannie et comes Andegavie, archiepiscopis, episcopis, abbatibus, comitibus, baronibus, justiciariis, forestariis, vicecomitibus, prepositis, ministris et omnibus ballivis et fidelibus suis salutem.

Not even very difficult Latin, although a bit barbarous. Probably Middle English of this era would pose greater difficulties, because of the rapid changes in the the language at the time. But you can learn to read Middle English in a week, although it helps if you know Anglo-Saxon. Only the Northern dialects, like the language of the Pearl poet, pose much difficulty.
11 posted on 08/07/2003 5:58:16 PM PDT by proxy_user
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To: blam
A middle english wife joke:

A certayn artificer in londo there was which was sore syk that coud not well dygest hys mete/ to who a physico cam to gyue hym councell & seyd yt he sust vse to ete metis yt be light of dygestyon as small byrdys/ as sparous or swallous & especyall yt byrd yt ys callyd a wagtale whose fleshe ys meruelouse lyght of dygestyo because that byrd ys ever mouyng & syngyng. The sik man heryng the phesicion seyd so answeryd hym & seyd/ Syr yf that be the cause yt those birdys be lyght of dygestyon/ Than I know a mete ych lyghter of dygestion tha other sparow swallow or wagtale/ & that ys my wyvys tog for it is neuer in rest but euer mouying & styrryng.
12 posted on 08/07/2003 6:25:40 PM PDT by seowulf
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To: seowulf
Birds were the cause of his indegistion so, stop eating birds?
13 posted on 08/07/2003 6:36:37 PM PDT by blam
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To: blam
Here is the translation:

So, there was this sick man who went to see a doctor because of his bad indigestion. The doctor told him he should eat meat from birds like swallows and wagtails. Their meat is light because they are always flying and flitting around and, so, are good for the digestion. The man said he knew of a much better meat for the digestion: his wife's tongue, because it is never still and is always moving and flitting about.

Hey. I didn't say it was a good joke!
14 posted on 08/07/2003 6:45:40 PM PDT by seowulf
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To: seowulf
Kind of late, nearly Early Modern. Fifteenth century, perhaps?

It seems that the 'o' at the end of 'Londo' and 'physico' represents a ligature that should be spelled out in a transcription. In the London dialects of the 14th and 15th centuries, the 'on' at the end of these words would have been strongly pronounced, as is evident from Chaucer's verse.
15 posted on 08/07/2003 6:53:26 PM PDT by proxy_user
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To: proxy_user
You are correct, of course. I believe it was from near the time of Chaucer (late middle English). And the "Londo~", etc. was an artifact of the handwriting. French derived words would have still had that pronunciation.
16 posted on 08/07/2003 9:42:19 PM PDT by seowulf
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To: seowulf
And the "Londo~", etc. was an artifact of the handwriting

As is the Y in "yt". This is probably the "thorn", a symbol used for "th" which looks similar to the letter Y, much as the & symbol is a ligature of "et" (latin and).

17 posted on 08/11/2003 7:17:56 AM PDT by LexBaird (Views seen in this tag are closer than they appear.)
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