Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

To: Windsong
The Heart of Christianity is the Cross --- the Death and Resurrection of Jesus Christ. So far in your analysis you have not mentioned that.

In all other religions Salvation is based on Man's Good Works --- Man getting to Heaven on his own might. Sounds like that where you are Windsong!

Christianity recognizes that man can't save himself (even following the Law) because all are Sinners. Christianity is based on God's saving GRACE though the CROSS!

The Big Question: If you died tonight do you know that you have Salvation?
I can unequivocally say, yes, I will be in Heaven because of my Faith in Christ. And, yes, I was Baptized, but that had nothing to do with it. If one had to rely on one's Good Works, how would one ever know that one did enough Good Works to meet God's requirements?

If God saves people based on Good Works then where are we? Does God grade on the curve. Is 70 passing, such that if one gets a 70, he goes to Heaven, if a 69, he goes to Hell?
This kind of Salvation is like a box of Cracker Jacks, one does not know what prize he will get at the end of the road.

I'm glad I don't have to worry about that. My Good Works are purely (only) a gauge for my rewards in Heaven.

My Salvation is locked in stone!
108 posted on 08/02/2003 4:46:38 PM PDT by TRY ONE (")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 107 | View Replies ]


To: TRY ONE
The Heart of Christianity is the Cross --- the Death and Resurrection of Jesus Christ. So far in your analysis you have not mentioned that.

Yes, I have. Re-read it.

In all other religions Salvation is based on Man's Good Works --- Man getting to Heaven on his own might.

I assume you mean by other "religions", those religions that reject Christ..Buddhism, Islam, etc etc. That is not what we are discussing. We are discussing baptism..which is a commandment of Jesus himself. All of the apostles were baptised. Jesus was baptized. All of those at Ephesus, Corinth, etc etc...there are no unbaptized Christians in the NT. And you STILL have not accounted for the fact that you claimed that the thief on the cross wasn't baptized, when in fact you dont KNOW whether he was or wasnt.

The Big Question: If you died tonight do you know that you have Salvation? I can unequivocally say, yes, I will be in Heaven because of my Faith in Christ. And, yes, I was Baptized, but that had nothing to do with it. If one had to rely on one's Good Works, how would one ever know that one did enough Good Works to meet God's requirements?

Loving people by itself will not get you to heaven. That is correct. Baptism by itself will not get you to heaven, and that too is correct. But both of those things are required, along with other things.

After all, if you don't love people, which is said by Jesus to be the second greatest commandment, do you really think that you will make it to heaven? And when Jesus says "He who believes and is baptized will be saved", do you really think that omitting baptism out of that verse saves you, when it's inseperately joined to belief by the word "and"? We are to obey **ALL** of Jesus commands unconditionally. Look at what the scriptures says about obedience:

Romans 2:6-9

6) who "will render to each one according to his deeds."

7) eternal life to those who by patient continuance in doing good seek for glory, honor, and immortality;

8) but to those who are self-seeking and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness-indignation and wrath,

9) tribulation and anguish, on every soul of man who does evil, of the Jew first and also of the Greek;

Hebrews 5:9

9) And having been perfected, He became the author of eternal salvation to all who obey Him.

1 John 3:24

24) Now he who keeps His commandments abides in Him, and He in him. And by this we know that He abides in us, by the Spirit whom He has given us.

Revelation 22:14

14) Blessed are those who do His commandments, that they may have the right to the tree of life, and my enter through the gates into the city.

It should be obvious from these verses that the only way we will make it to heaven is if we obey His commandments. Bearing this in mind, even you can agree that baptism was commanded by Jesus, yes? If we obey His commandments, then what happens? We are saved. According to Hebrews 5:9, Jesus is the author of eternal salvation to all who obey Him. If you don't obey Him, is He the author of eternal salvation to that person? No.

17) "For Christ did not send me to baptize but to preach the gospel, not with wisdom of words, lest the cross of Christ should be made of no effect."

Paul is simply saying that baptism is not his main focus, not that baptism isn't necessary. Paul's main focus was to preach the word of God. Notice, however, that everybody spoken about in these verses were indeed baptized. It's just too bad that these people were making a big deal about who baptized them, or else Paul would have no need to rebuke them about this. Why would Paul preach that baptism isn't necessary when it was commanded by Jesus in Matthew 28:19,20?

If God saves people based on Good Works then where are we? Does God grade on the curve. Is 70 passing, such that if one gets a 70, he goes to Heaven, if a 69, he goes to Hell? This kind of Salvation is like a box of Cracker Jacks, one does not know what prize he will get at the end of the road.

9) "And having been perfected, He became the author of eternal salvation to all who obey Him."

It clearly states that He is the author of salvation to who? All who obey Him. Where do you think that leaves the people that don't obey Him? I'll spell it out just so there's no confusion: HELL.

So again, who are you to say that baptism is not necessary, when the Lord has commanded it? Answer that question please.

My Salvation is locked in stone!

Judas thought the same, I am certain. When James says that faith without works is dead, I'm going to believe him over you that says faith only will save me. Call me crazy.

There many verses in the Bible that speak relevant things about our salvation. Things like (paraphrasing here) "Unless you are born of water and Spirit you will not enter the kingdom of God", "unless you repent you will all perish", "He who believes and is baptized will be saved", "It is by grace you have been saved", "we are justified by faith".

Everyone of those pertains to our salvation, so which one is correct, because they all state something different? The simple answer is ALL of them, NOT just one (faith). What kind of faith do you think Romans 5:1 is talking about? Faith without works? Surely not, because James, who is just as inspired as Paul, said that faith without works is dead. No amount of spin doctering or perverting of the scriptures will change that simple fact.

109 posted on 08/04/2003 3:44:14 AM PDT by Windsong
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 108 | View Replies ]

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article


FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson