CIA didn't get disputed documents until February 2003 after Bush claim

Boston Globe ^ | 7-16-03 | John J. Lumpkin

[cyncooper]

Did the British ever stake their claim on the forged document? Even partially?

No, they never did. They explicitly stated that they never saw the forged documents until they were revealed as such and made news. They never figured into their intelligence conclusions.

[cyncooper]

See this thread from yesterday. It had me doing my own Googling and posting my own 1999 media finds.

Bin Laden and Iraq

The whole world back then thought it likely and probable that Saddam and Osama were forging a partnership.

As I said on that thread, the link has not been proven, of course, but it shows that it was not an idea made up by George W. Bush.

Once again, we've been lied to. And clinton sat back and said not one word. (Having created this new spin that GWB was making stuff up because Osama would NEVER have anything to do with that infidel, Saddam.)

[swany]

Tenant took the hit because he made a mistake.

You said it yourself in post 27 .. "But that's part of the problem you see.... Using unvetted info that couldn't be documented at the time....."

Because it was unvetted and couldn't be documented or corroborated by the CIA (even though it came from trusted allies), Tenant is saying he should have operated on the side of caution and had them take out the reference all together.

I understand this to mean even the broadbrush statement using "Africa" instead of "Nigeria", since Britain has been unable to share sources with the CIA so they could verify any and all intelligence.

Just my take.

[Ethyl]

Thank you, Mr. Bush for your quantified answer, I guess there was nothing there but waiste. I'm glad that somebody else saw that article.

[Dog]

I never thought to look at the Plame-Ritter angle...hmmm!

Will now.......thanks!

[George W. Bush]

I don't know if you're still interested in this fact sheet but I glanced at it again and noticed that in this list of eight suppliers, the IAEA says 4 shipments were 'imported' and the other four, including the two Niger shipments were 'procured'.

'Imported' sounds like they bought it directly and above board. 'Procured' sounds like that was the source but that it might have gone through a third party. Like France.

Now I'd like to know exactly how IAEA defines 'imported' and 'procured'.

[shamusotoole]

I'm running on my own recollections only, but... Didn't Hans Blix, Kofi Annan, Saddam Hussein and a few others all debunk the Niger Trade documents suspiciously quickly, even when our own folks accepted them at face value because on their face, they looked authentic.

I believe there were even details mentioned, like an out-of-date Niger Official Seal, and a Trade Minister's signature, who hadn't been around for awhile.

I'd like to know a timeline about this document. That may give us a better idea of whodunnit, or who had it done.

[George W. Bush]

See my #51 for the link to backhoe's master resource thread on this Niger flap. You'll find info on the document's history there on a number of different threads.

[ReaganRevolution]

Good news if you haven't heard it yet:Pentagon Bombshell: U.S. Uncovers WMD Document 'Mother Lode' (Newsmax) The Pentagon's chief weapons inspector David Kay has uncovered what is being described as a "mother lode" of documents in Iraq detailing Saddam Hussein's weapons of mass destruction program.

Because the dems are losing a grip on the uranium, David Kay's comments are flying under the radar. When his report is ready to be released the dems are going to look like idiots and no one will remember anything about the infamous "16 words" on uranium.

[hobbes1]

Of course, it's a slow news month so the DNC has to make some splash so their media allies can give their candidates some free face time to spew the DNC talking points ('pattern') under the guise of news.

I don't think you fully appreciate how right that is..

p> First of all, Wilson was involved in a game that apparently is over his head.

He was sent because he was Trusted....Now lets look at what he did.

It is no secret that he is an avowed lefty partisan....check up on the info available about him...

Now, Let's examine the timing involved....

SOTU----Jan 23 2003.
Wilson On McLehrer here---Feb 6,2003 NOTHING ABOUT URANIUM/NIGER/SOTU....
Wilson has Op-ed in the Nation here----3/3,2003 NOTHING ABOUT URANIUM/NIGER/SOTU....
War With Iraq----March 20,2003
Combat Phase ends----April 15,2003
Wilsons Op-ed----July 06,2003 Almost 6 months, after the fact....
Bush Leaves for AfricaJuly 07,2003

Dems release attack ad July 10, 2003 ....4 days after Wilsons Op-ed..

Now given the dems reliance on garnering every single Black vote cast, and quaking with fear that Bush in Afri ca, talking about Aids and Help in Liberia would dominate the news, what do you think Wilsons op-ed had more to do with, a War that is over and won, or Partisan Politics?

He thought he could do it and get away with it.
He was wrong....

[George W. Bush]

Superb listing. I'm impressed.

You should flag the other Wilson watchers to this. Or post it on Backhoe's thread.

Now given the dems reliance on garnering every single Black vote cast...

It's not actually 'reliance'. They simply cannot fail to get every 'black' vote cast. Dark-skinned people like Rice and Powell and Justice Thomas are, by definition, not 'black'. They say this repeatedly. But a white man, Clinton, is America's 'first black president', joining the company of some other whites who in the category once known as 'honorary Negro', back in the civil rights era. Therefore, no black person can ever vote for a Republican or, ipso facto, they are not black and they cannot be a member of the 'black' community. Voting Republican is inviting excommunication from your community if you are a dark-skinned person.

[Howlin]

George, did you give me an estimate about how much space 250 tons would require? If you did, I missed it and I apologize.

Backhoe, PICK UP!

[hobbes1]

Actually it came from the "White house smear" thread...

[Dolphy]

It seems really difficult to get a timing on this because the information comes out in dribs and drabs and varies. Somewhere here yesterday I read that we didn't actually have the forged documents in hand until after the State of the Union address. And I don't know that I am sure who provided the documents to the UN.

I believe there were even details mentioned, like an out-of-date Niger Official Seal, and a Trade Minister's signature, who hadn't been around for awhile.

I am very suspicious of the forgery story. Don't you think a document of that information would fetch more than a few thousand dollars as has been reported? And since the British say that their information regarding the uranium is independednt of this forged document, couldn't the forgery be some sort of move to counter other information they had?

[Dolphy]

Oops, correction, it's hard to concentrate when the phone keeps ringing. Obviously I read on this thread about the hard copy of the document and when the CIA got its hands on it. What I meant to say is that the information comes out drip by drip so it is hard to get a read on it.

[Grampa Dave]

If you know any Black conservatives who have voted for GW and other republicans ask them how their family, friends and blacks who don't know them treat them for being conservative.

The treatment of Black Conservatives by left wing Blacks is real racism and hate crimes wrapped into the same terrible thing.

[George W. Bush]

The treatment of Black Conservatives by left wing Blacks is real racism and hate crimes wrapped into the same terrible thing.

But, that's just it. They voted Republican. Therefore, they are not and cannot be 'black'. The Dims keep saying it. Clinton is 'black', Rice/Powell/Thomas are not 'black'.

Even here among FR's hardened veterans, this kind of weird racial hypocrisy coming from the Dim party hacks and NAACP is a bit of a shock.

I'm afraid I live in too pale an area to know any blacks currently. We just don't happen to have any. But we have a very nice Hispanic clan in town. All good Republicans, very nice folks. Assimilationist immigrants, not migrants. Good stock. We're lucky to have them. (And they're lucky to have us as a matter of fact.) It's a happy immigration story for all. Kind of like my own grandfather, a first-generation German immigrant.

[George W. Bush]

You might look at the two preceding posts. Any black conservatives done any writing on just how far this no-black-can-vote-Republican thing has gone? I guess you're the first person I could think of.

[George W. Bush]

George, did you give me an estimate about how much space 250 tons would require? If you did, I missed it and I apologize.

Yes. Look here.

Two shipments, one with 432 drums, the second with 426 drums. Now, how big is a 'drum'? I assume something the size of an oil barrel (3' high, diameter ~20"). I don't know what the smallest space that you could pack that into would be but I'm guessing much less than the hold of a medium or small cargo ship. Or maybe you could estimate that you could get 80 drums (barrel-sized) into a medium-sized mobile container (like the kind that are shipped without wheels but then have wheels attached so they can be pulled around by a semi tractor, for instance).

Of course, that all depends on just how big a 'drum' really is.

BTW, notice in my list that four sources are listed as 'imported' and the other four, including Niger, are listed as 'procured'. So Niger, if they were the source of Saddam's uranium, may not have known who actually bought it. Especially if France, who manages the Niger mines and who at that same time sold Saddam the Osirik reactor, was arranging the transfers through third parties.

That last bit of speculation on my part would explain a lot about the Niger connection.

[techcor]

They can't claim Bush knew the uranium story wasn't true because the CIA didn't get the document until after the SOTU

You're kidding right? Some of the Dem Senators are saying they were swayed by the "lies" in the SOTU speech and wouldn't have voted to give Bush the power to go to war with Iraq if they had known the truth. Funny thing is though. They voted in October and the speech wasn't until January. Of course, they babble this nonsense to the reporters from ABC,CBS,CNN,etc. and all the reporter does is nod his head.
Curt Weldon was pointing this out on C-SPAN last night. It was great. He was really ripping the Dems apart. He needs to do it on O'reilly or some news show.