[Deb]

First of all, the Medicare bill hasn't even gone to committee yet and the Republicans still have a chance to add the elements that will move it toward privitization or stall it completely in committee.

Every time you say the "antics of the GOP", you lose the argument, because there are lots of factions in the members. The conservatives are constantly battling the "moderates" and I never see any of you screamers on the threads where the conservatives win those battles.

And I don't say "Elect more Republicans". I say, "Elect more Conservatives". I don't want Republicans like Lincoln Chaffey, Olympia Snowe or Houghton anymore than you do. But left-wing states elect left-wing Republicans. That's a political reality and has nothing to do with the whole party.

[dirtboy]

First of all, the Medicare bill hasn't even gone to committee yet and the Republicans still have a chance to add the elements that will move it toward privitization or stall it completely in committee.

The bill should never have gotten out of either the House or the Senate in its current forms, and Bush should veto it if it reaches his desk. We simply do not need another senior entitlement, and we need someone to stand up to the senior lobby, excercise leadership and say what needs to be said. We can't afford this entitlement, entitlements almost never shrink once you create them, and it takes more money away from working families and gives it to people who, for the most part, can pay for medicine themselves. And the child tax credit to people who don't pay taxes is nothing more than welfare in another form. These are NOT conservative values, and it's hardly being a conservative purist to decry these actions.

Every time you say the "antics of the GOP", you lose the argument, because there are lots of factions in the members.

There were about 20 GOP congressmen trying to block passage of the bill. That's less than ten percent. I think that 90+ percent of the GOP Congress, plus the Senate, plus the President, is a pretty good indication of what the GOP is doing.

[hchutch]

That's the whole thing a lot of people are not realizing. The privatization will emerge out of the conference committee - it has to have that in order for the House to pass it, you see. And guess who will end up with a political Hobson's choice?

The Democrats, particularly the ones in the Senate.

You see, if they kill the package, they will lose a lot of votes. but at the same time voting for something with privatization will tick off their base, which either gives Howard Dean the nomination OR it creates a Green Party insurgency.

Newt Gingrich TALKED about privatization. George W. Bush and the GOP of 2003 are in the process of making it happen - achieving the results. Personally, I'll take results over talk.