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To: betty boop
Thank yoyu for your keen insights. I don't see the 10th Amendment as much of a safe haven nor battleship here, though. It is simply contradictory to say that matters such as marriage and pro-life (and freedom from slavery) are so critical that the future of our nation depends upon them, and yet to say that it should be a matter of compromise and laissez faire for federal policy, left instead for the states to decide.

Even ignoring the consequences, that very objective, as it may be imagined, will cause opponents to ridicule (and very reasonably so).

518 posted on 07/01/2003 1:59:48 PM PDT by unspun ("Do everything in love.")
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To: betty boop
The only answer I can come up with though, is that it's a battle that needs to be fought wherever it can be... sort of like pouring water over the big nasty thing and looking for where it might seep in.

Sadly, though, it is a "numbers game" and "the big nasty thing" is our populace.
519 posted on 07/01/2003 2:20:34 PM PDT by unspun ("Do everything in love.")
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To: unspun; Alamo-Girl; Phaedrus; Luis Gonzalez; tpaine; DAnconia55
I don't see the 10th Amendment as much of a safe haven nor battleship here, though. It is simply contradictory to say that matters such as marriage and pro-life (and freedom from slavery) are so critical that the future of our nation depends upon them, and yet to say that it should be a matter of compromise and laissez faire for federal policy, left instead for the states to decide.

Thank you so much, Brother Arlen, for your excellent and insightful (multiple) replies. There's not a thing you said that I would disagree with. For what you seemed to be saying is something quite uncontroversial to me: The problem is in the culture, not in the political institutions per se. POLITICS FOLLOWS CULTURE. And IMHO you were right to see in ancient Athens a better analog to our present situation than Rome.

Which is why I said, to staunch the bleeding, diversify the political centers, devolve political power from Washington to the 50 centers that are closer to us where we live, where we may have greater personal impact on shaping the public discourse. This is the exact reverse of what the Left has been working at, with incredible success, for over 50 years at least. It'll only buy you some time. But maybe something can be done in that time to get the culture back into a more sane position, by empowering the "grass roots" to a greater degree. Plus you get to try (potentially) 50 different approaches to public policy questions, and then get to see what "works." It has been remarked that the states are great laboratories of sociopolitical experiment. I think that's true; but Washington entirely obviates this process. States conform to its will, not the other way around.

For Plato, the polis -- political society -- is man writ large. For Marx, political society is man writ small. But to make the latter work requires man to really be small in the great scale of things.

The point of both cases is, if man, by and large, is disordered, so will be the society of which he is part and participant. Thus we have a cultural problem, which inevitably drives the political. In the end, we get what we "deserve."

Work needs to be done on the cultural side, before political realities can be shaped. Marx knew this -- very, very well. And masterfully exploited this knowledge. And that is why the America we know and love is dying, right in front of our very eyes.

524 posted on 07/01/2003 4:20:00 PM PDT by betty boop (We can have either human dignity or unfettered liberty, but not both. -- Dean Clancy)
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