BLAME THE GOP FOR PRO-SODOMY COURT DECISION

The Heustis Update ^ | June 27, AD 2003 | Reed R. Heustis, Jr.

[unspun]

And reason tells us that any law is essentially and operationally a moral statement: "This is good to do." "That is not good to do."

That is a matter of behavior, however, not of enforcing belief.

"He who governs best, governs least," but least meaning do not legislate where there is no interest for the protection and preservation of our lives or our free society.

[cherry_bomb88]

There is a reason that America is more civilized, if you want to mess around with young girls, move to Italy or Britan.

As for being a tough guy, make that a tough gal, and internet or no internet, I'd knock ya out...

Unspun, do you think I'd hold true on my promise if DAnconia so much as looked at my girls wrong????

[cherry_bomb88]

but least meaning do not legislate where there is no interest for the protection and preservation of our lives or our free society.

Agreed, otherwise you'd have free reign anarchy and the world would turn to cahos....akin to the old lawless west where people would shoot you for looking at them wrong...of course, in the case of DA, I'd like to have that ability...he seems to condone pedifelia, which makes me think he's a low life slime that would partake in sexual act with a 14 year old if he lived in a state/country where it was legal.

[unspun]

Agreed, otherwise you'd have free reign anarchy and the world would turn to cahos....akin to the old lawless west where people would shoot you for looking at them wrong...of course, in the case of DA, I'd like to have that ability...he seems to condone pedifelia, which makes me think he's a low life slime that would partake in sexual act with a 14 year old if he lived in a state/country where it was legal.

I still want to hear what DA thinks of Jean Jacques Rousseau.

An authentic Totalibertarian is a breed to behold. Wanna safari? ;-) Law of the Jungle, baby.

[betty boop]

Also, is the principle that Lincoln derived from Scritpure, that a man does not have the right to do what is wrong.

True, unspun. Then again, no man can be the "conscience" of another....

There are lots of things that happen in our society that don't exactly make me jump up and down for joy. You mentioned legalized gambling. I think it hurts people, especially people in the working class who have to make ends meet from slender paychecks. These people can't afford to be gambling away their children's food and clothing, etc.; but they are disproportionately the majority of legal gamblers.

The majority of the people in my state -- Massachusetts -- want to have legalized gambling: the lottery, scratch tickets, dogs and horses, and so forth. Some even want casino gambling, which, given our present governor, is probably going to be a "hard-sell."

The point is, I have to accept this with good grace. I can try to change the status quo via grass-roots activities in the local communities; but failing that, it's the law in my state. The politicians love the vast revenue stream....

Morality either comes "from the bottom up," or it doesn't happen. The state has no means to impose it from on high and, in the case of legalized gambling, zero incentive to do so anyway. It would be illegitimate for it to try.... (On the Caesar/God paradigm alluded to earlier.)

Perhaps the only way out of a situation like this would be for people to be better educated so they would know where their best interests lie. That's not a process that can happen overnight.

A minimalist government (i.e., a legitimate, just one) can really hold a man responsible for "doing wrong" only to the extent that his wrong-doing can be shown to be injurious of the life, liberty, and property of another person. Absent that, the Constitution doesn't give the courts all that much to do.

[DAnconia55]

Ok. But I don't disagree with you here :

1) "Render unto Caesar what is Caesar's, and unto God what is God's." (I.e., the moral code is not something that any just, legitimate government can impose. Morality is simply not something that can be imposed at all, without violating the dignity and sanctity of the human person.)

(2) "Love thy neighbor as thyself." (I.e., live and let live).

You seem to be missing an important point.

Just because you will play nicely with others, doesn't mean the rest of them will. Unspun included.

I'm only bigotted against brownshirt wannabe Fundies. I have no problem with actual meek Christians. It's the "Christians" that get me up in arms....

[unspun]

Thanks bb.

A minimalist government (i.e., a legitimate, just one) can really hold a man responsible for "doing wrong" only to the extent that his wrong-doing can be shown to be injurious of the life, liberty, and property of another person.

Alas, this being the case, it is also true that evil behavior (even snorting cocaine, or a suicide attempt, for two examples) is definitely harmful to other persons, whether they are those who love us, those who pay taxes to clean up our messes, or those whose lives we affect in future generations by the society to which our influence is detrimental.

We live interrelated and interdependent lives. That is of the truths self evident.

[unspun]

You seem to be missing an important point. Just because you will play nicely with others, doesn't mean the rest of them will. Unspun included. I'm only bigotted against brownshirt wannabe Fundies. I have no problem with actual meek Christians. It's the "Christians" that get me up in arms....

WADR, please articulate a point if you believe it is an important one. Even explicate, if you would be so kind.

(Please hang with us, c_b.)

[DAnconia55]

he seems to condone pedifelia, which makes me think he's a low life slime that would partake in sexual act with a 14 year old if he lived in a state/country where it was legal

Spelling is our friend.

Seems to me you have an argument with God. (And the Church).

Marriages were good enough for 12 year olds before. Approved by society and the church. And girls bodies enable them to breed at age 14.

My point - lost on a Fundie, I'm sure - is that the age of consent is arbitrary. Why is 18 better than 16?

Because you were told so. That's why.
Just like if you were alive before 12 would have been ok. And you'd REACT (not think) the same way about 12 yr olds as you do now about 18 yr olds.

Animal. Not man. Someone pushes your buttons, you get a jolt and react.

Just pointing out ignorance. Pretty easy to do these days.

Just curious... (yeah, I know I'll be sorry I asked) :
Give me an Objective Moral Reason. That the age of consent should be 18.... (is not everywhere in the US, BTW. Bet you didn't know that).... and not 17 and 6 months. Or 19. Or 47. Or 16?

Hint : Because it's the law isn't a valid answer.

[DAnconia55]

And I ever do SO love the slander of your types. No better way to fight, I suppose. FYI 18-21 yr olds bore me now. Too old for them. And they have no experience.

I'd like to have that ability...he seems to condone pedifelia, which makes me think he's a low life slime that would partake in sexual act with a 14 year old if he lived in a state/country where it was legal.

SINCE we're playing...
For bonus points, state the contradiction in your own post!

[unspun]

I suggest we ask DA to "articulate/explicate" as I've asked him, before answering his false notion of an "objective" reason for age of consent (which merely shows how foolish it is to seek objective answers where answers are validly subjective).

[tpaine]

...you're grasping at straws....


hardly, tpaine: I'm trying to throw you a life preserver.


My support for our constitution is not endangered, betty.
It is your moralistic agenda that is threatened by the Laurence decision.

[DAnconia55]

AH heck.... just for kicks. Since it's the topic at hand.

---

 

		Straight Sex	Barney Frank	Ellen DeGeneres
United Kingdom	England, Scotland & Wales  Rev 06/2001	16	16	16
United Kingdom	Northern Ireland            Rev 06/2001	17	17	17
USA	Alabama   Rev 06/2001	16	illegal	illegal
USA	Alaska       Rev 08/2000	16	16	16
USA	Arizona    Rev 06/2001	18	Law Repealed	Law Repealed
USA	Arkansas   Rev 03/2001	16	Law Invalidated	Law Invalidated
USA	California Rev 04/2001	18	18	18
USA	Colorado  Rev 04/2002	15/17	17	17
USA	Connecticut Rev 04/2001	16	16	16
USA	D.C.    Rev 08/2000	16	Law Repealed	Law Repealed
USA	Delaware Rev 03/2002	16/18	Law Repealed	Law Repealed
USA	Florida Rev 06/2001	16/18	Illegal	Illegal
USA	Georgia   Rev 07/2002 MUST READ!	16	16	16
USA	Hawaii   Rev 03/2002	16	Law Repealed	Law Repealed
USA	Idaho   Rev 04/2001	16/18	Illegal	Illegal
USA	Illinois	17	17	17
USA	Indiana	16	16	16
USA	Iowa   Rev 03/2002	14/16	Law Repealed	Law Repealed
USA	Kansas   Rev 06/2001	16	illegal	illegal
USA	Kentucky	16	Law Invalidated	Law Invalidated
USA	Louisiana Rev 03/2002	17	Illegal	Illegal
USA	Maine	16	16	16
USA	Maryland Rev 04/2002	16	Law Invalidated	Law Invalidated
USA	Massachusetts Rev 07/2002	16/18	READ -Law Invalidated	READ -Law Invalidated
USA	Michigan Rev 04/2001	16	Illegal	Illegal
USA	Minnesota Rev 03/2002	16	Law Invalidated	Law Invalidated
USA	Mississippi Rev 03/2002	16 (laws passed June 1, 1998)	Illegal	Illegal
USA	Missouri   Rev 03/2002	14/17	Illegal	Illegal
USA	Montana   Rev 10/99	16/18	18	18
USA	Nebraska	17	Law Repealed	Law Repealed
USA	Nevada   Rev 1/2000	16	18	18
USA	New Hampshire Rev 03/2002	16	18	18
USA	New Jersey	16	16	16
USA	New Mexico	17	13	13
USA	New York  Rev 03/2002	17	17	17
USA	North Carolina    Rev 03/2002	16	Illegal	Illegal
USA	North Dakota	18	Law Repealed	Law Repealed
USA	Ohio   Rev 11/2000	16	Law Repealed	Law Repealed
USA	Oklahoma Rev 03/2002	16	16 -illegal???	16 -illegal???
USA	Oregon	18	18	18
USA	Pennsylvania	16	16	16
USA	Rhode Island       Rev 06/2001	16	Law Repealed	Law Repealed
USA	South Carolina Rev 03/2002	14/16-bill pending	Illegal	Illegal
USA	South Dakota	16	Law Repealed  16	Law Repealed  16
USA	Tennessee Rev 04/2001	18	Law Invalidated	Law Invalidated
USA	Texas    Rev 03/2002	17	Illegal 03/2001	Illegal 03/2001
USA	Utah   Rev Rev 04/2001	16/18	Illegal	Illegal
USA	Vermont	16	Law Repealed	Law Repealed
USA	Virginia Rev 07/2000	18	illegal	illegal
USA	Washington    Rev 06/2001	16/18	16/18	16/18
USA	West Virginia	16	18?	18?
USA	Wisconsin Rev 03/2002	18	18	18
USA	Wyoming Rev 12/99	16 / 18?	Law Repealed	Law Repealed
USA	Military   Rev 06/2001	16	illegal	illegal

[DAnconia55]

Man them damn New Jerseians are HEATHENS!

HEATHENS, I Say!

I say we hang 'em by the naick until daid!

[unspun]

My support for our constitution is not endangered, betty. It is your moralistic agenda that is threatened by the Laurence decision.

That is humorous, tp. Have to hand it to you. Here's a question for you. What is a three letter word for "moral code?" I'll give you a hint, first letter is an "L" and the last is a "W."

Maybe you would buy an "O" come to think about it! LOL

[DAnconia55]

And we should invade these people and tell them how to run things too. After all, it's a moral imperative. We're right because..... umm... because... Wait! It'll come to me...
Oh! Because they told me so!! Yeah. That's it.

---

France Rev 01/2001 15 15 15
Germany Rev 01/2001 14/16 14/16 14/16
Israel         Rev 03/2001 16 16 16
Italy Rev 06/2001 14 14 14
Poland Rev 01/2001 15 15 15
Puerto Rico Rev 01/2001 14 Illegal (under appeal) Illegal (under appeal)
Spain               Rev 01/2001 13 13 13
Sweden Rev 01/2001 15 15 15
Switzerland Rev 01/2001   16 16 16

I suppose we don't have to invade yet. After all there's plenty of work to be done right here! And you thought you had to be 18... well, well, well.

[DAnconia55]

I simply don't believe the age of consent for Arkansas is as high as 16......

What's an Arkansas girl say after sex?

[tpaine]

Whatta twit you are, spinner.
-- Go bother someone else with your inane babbling.
- Please.

[unspun]

Why any of these ages you've just posted, DA? Because you like any of the countries? What is the age that you would pick for the age of consent?

Why?

Is that answer utterly objective?

[Luis Gonzalez]

"What's an Arkansas girl say after sex?"

"Are you all really on the same team?"