Middle class faces extinction

The News-Press ^ | June 15, 2003 | JANE R. JOHNSON, N. Fort Myers

[Willie Green]

The worst thing that the politicians have done to this country was to sign NAFTA. The Republicans and Democrats are both to blame. The companies in this country said that unless they went overseas for cheaper labor costs, their companies would not survive. At first, I thought if they only sold to the people overseas, it would be all right. So the companies erected plants overseas but then they started closing their plants in America. Now they manufacture overseas and export to America and we have to import the products to be sold here. No wonder our imports are higher than our exports.

[Henrietta]

Well, take heart. Every rich person you resent is probably paying a much greater percentage of their income in taxes than you are, as well as a much bigger dollar amount.

And their taxes are funding the emergency rooms in much bigger amounts than yours are.

You said: "All because they like servants who are abject and humble, "muchas gracias, padron.""

Actually, I think the most important thing to anyone is to just get the job done.

[Henrietta]

"The libertarian philosphy and country-club Republicans aren't thinking about the masses--that thinking will come back to bite their kids or grandkids in the butt, however, when the masses revolt in a few decades."

Ah, yes, more Socialist fantasies. If you want a revolution of the classes, you'd better teach your kids to shoot.

By then, most of the wealth will have fled the country because of socialist tax policies, so your larcenous progeny will have nothing to steal...

Keep blaming the "country club Republicans"...it's easier than working to leave some money for your kids, isn't it?

[Mamzelle]

re: Actually, I think the most important thing to anyone is to just get the job done. )))

Nope. They love the power rush they get, and they like to feel like a hero when they hire cheap off-the-books help.

re: And their taxes are funding the emergency rooms in much bigger amounts than yours are. )))

How do you know what I pay? The ERs are in danger of being shut down entirely due to many pressures, and the recent flood of illegals (who know they'll be treated free of charge) into the ERs is a very large part of what will make them unavailable.

What hurts the local hospital systems is that the employer pays in cash, and no medicare/SS taxes go out of his pocket to help defray the costs to the community. But he enjoys all the advantages of cheap labor--and the nice pat to his ego. I watch this every day--the rich folks bend themselves into moral pretzels to convince themselves that breaking the law makes them the Great White Father.

[Henrietta]

"They love the power rush they get, and they like to feel like a hero when they hire cheap off-the-books help. "

So you mean that in the same situation YOU would get a power rush, so you assume other people would feel the same way?

That's a psychologic phenomena called "transferrence."

And how do I know how much you pay? Well, your "us vs. them" mentality toward the rich says that you aren't rich. Since rich people pay the vast majority of taxes in this country (far disproportionate to their "fair share"), and you are not rich, then they must be paying more in taxes than you. Simple logic.

[Henrietta]

My kids (if I have any) will be doctors, lawyers, or other professionals.

Yours can mow lawns, pick vegetables, and plan the next revolution.

Smart people can do well in ANY economic climate. You seem bent on feeding your kids defeatist tripe. I only hope for their sake that they don't eat what you're feeding them.

[Mamzelle]

Talk about yourself, if you like, but you haven't a clue about anyone else you're talking to on a political forum, including me--

"These poor folks want the work so bad. It just breaks my heart."

This is the lead-in for how lawbreaking employers rationalize breaking the law. They make it out to be their great big hearts bleeding for the poor peons who scrub the ten toilets in their McMansion.

[Under the Radar]

All third world countries have a rich class and a very large poor class. How come all that purchasing power they have in countries like Haiti and Mexico ---where there are actually plenty of rich --as many as anywhere, are doing so poorly? It's the middle class and only the middle class that matters. Without the middle class we're like any other third world hole.

BUMP

[LibertyAndJusticeForAll]

So you mean that in the same situation YOU would get a power rush, so you assume other people would feel the same way?

That's a psychologic phenomena called "transferrence."

No that's called "projection". And the reason they probably get a power rush is because they get paid a big bonus for hiring cheap off-the-books help. There is an equation between $$ and power, so it was a reasonable guess at their emotional state.

[Mamzelle]

The illegals have gotten the word--they know that the personnel in the ER are not allowed to ask about residency status (not that they want that job)--and that they won't have to worry about the bill. How I'd love to stick that bill to the McMissus in the McMansion.

Are you aware that these ERs are also required, by law, to have a translator available?

Everyone worries about this new Medicare prescrip thing. I just don't much care. It'll all collapse soon, anyway. I just got a huge bill for a minor surgery--and I know why it was huge. I'm being "taxed" ... illegal alien tax, low reimbursement by indigent tax, lawyer tax, lawyer tax, lawyer tax...

[LibertyAndJusticeForAll]

We are not feeding our kids defeatists tripe. We are looking at a Brave New World without a middle-class and wondering what will be best for our children.
Right now, there are thousands of really smart engineers out of work. They are out of work because there are too many visa workers here (1.2 million), there are too many high-tech jobs suddenly being outsourced (millions in the next few years) and there is an overall recession.
The steelworkers, automotive workers (watch a rerun of "Mr. Mom" again), the manufacturing jobs went first. Now it is high-tech, next accounting and it goes on. One corporate exec said that any job behind a desk can be easily outsourced. The rest can be handled by visa workers.
So, what can we do? Write to congress and the whitehouse.
"Buy American" and tell others.
I'll scare you some more. Right now the databases with the records of your medical, credit card, banking, insurance, telecommunications are being run and accessed by foreigners in foreign countries. Think identify theft is a problem now? Wait until we cannot even get to the perpetrators because they are overseas. Think that India and China might be more accessible to terrorists for some cyber terrorism? I do.

[Longshanks]

I guess you forgot that Andy also made his business investments in America, providing employment for Americans.

Plus Carnegie was a great beneficiary of the steep tariffs that undergirded the post-Civil War economic boom in America. At the same time, Britain pursued a free-trade policy that hollowed out its economy and set the stage for decline to second-rate status.

[FITZ]

Smart people can do well in ANY economic climate.

That's absolutely 100% wrong. Look at Mexico for example ---some of their elite are dumb as bricks ---and I mean really dumb, they're lazy, they won't work but they get their jobs through family status. Some of the poor illegals are actually sharp as tacks, they might never have stepped foot in school, before they came here they often never drove a car, never drove a tractor ---yet they are quite smart and pick up very quickly. That's why third world systems are so inferior ---when you are born to the bottom class, you are expected to stay there. Some of their browner lower class have the brains ----but they've never been taught to read and write ---so much is wasted.

[FITZ]

My kids (if I have any) will be doctors, lawyers, or other professionals.

In third world countries, the doctors are not especially wealthy. They're lucky if they make what a factory worker makes here ---so don't be too excited about your kid's future in a society with no middle class ----corrupt lawyers do tend to do well in third world economies ----tell them to go that way.

[Willie Green]

At the same time, Britain pursued a free-trade policy that hollowed out its economy and set the stage for decline to second-rate status.

Excellent point. Carnegie helped make America strong by importing technology and exporting goods.
Today's globalists are doing just the opposite, targetting America's prosperous Middle Class as a market to be plundered and sunk into debt.

[FITZ]

Why should employers pay for employee health care??

Maybe we shouldn't even have health care ---the employees with wages dropping down below $10 an hour can't buy their own policies, the employers can't afford to buy them insurance, the government certainly can't afford it either. Going to a doctor or hospital, getting lab tests or an X-ray simply costs too much now.

[califirst]

"Buy American" and tell others.

Changed your tune ? I thought Just "Buy American" will not be enough.......

Can I stop subsidising Unions ?