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This plan is direct and addresses the ultimate crux of the issue and root of the problem ... which is the terrorist activities being suported and harbored within the Palestinian territories. The Palestinians themselves must act forcefully, directly and sincerely to stop this if there is any hope for peace.

The plan itself was originally described in a more basic form to me here on FR by Travis McGee and then included in a more detailed fashion in my book series, THE DDRAGON'S FURY SERIES, about World War III arising out of an unholy allinace between Red China and the fundamental Islamic nation. I present it here as a suggestion, alternative or starting point for discussion.

Jeff Head

1 posted on 06/11/2003 12:44:39 PM PDT by Jeff Head
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To: Jeff Head
Well,shoot. Talk about a misleading headline.

I thought somebody finally had a plan fer paving the Golan Heights.
64 posted on 06/11/2003 8:54:42 PM PDT by wrbones (Bones)
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To: ApesForEvolution
BUMP.
95 posted on 06/23/2003 4:12:08 PM PDT by Jeff Head
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To: yonif
FYI.
97 posted on 07/04/2003 1:24:01 PM PDT by Jeff Head
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To: Jeff Head
I agree overall, however, here is where I have problems:

1. You talk about the " Palestinian people " however, there has never been such a people...It is all an invention. They are Arabs from Jordan and Egypt.

2. Therefore, even if they get rid of the terrorists, which will not work, because of the fact these terrorists not only are in those territories, but from the entire Arab world. For example, Islamic Jihad and Hamas are based in Syria. So even if the territories were "empty" of terrorists, I'll be more would be sent into them after they become a state.

3. The new state, even if it is democratically elected, etc. will be aligned with the Arab world, therefore, defense pacts with other states will raise, etc. and the Arab world will just continue their plans of using that state to finally destroy Israel, because it would now be at its suicidal borders of 1967. Terrorism will restart.

4. But overall, I believe like you, we must give those Arabs an altimatum like we gave 48 hours to the Taliban regime.

Please see this plan by a right-wing minister in Sharon's government: Click here

99 posted on 07/05/2003 8:11:51 AM PDT by yonif
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To: Ragtime Cowgirl
IMHO, we need to let the Israelis pull off the gloves and implement something like this to put an end to the terror within their own territories once and for all.
109 posted on 10/04/2003 10:59:36 AM PDT by Jeff Head
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To: Jeff Head
Your solution would take too long and the terrorists don't care how many they murder.
Israel should not only do as you suggestl they should immediately make plans to wipe out Islamic Jihad, Hamas, PLO, PLA, etc. post haste and do the same to whoever else declares war upon them which these terrorists most certainly have done.
116 posted on 10/04/2003 11:49:00 AM PDT by DianaN (Eternal Freedom)
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To: Jeff Head
Around 80% of the so called "Palestinians" approve of or sympathize with the attacks and manuevers of the terrorists.
Why should ANY more innocent Israelis die?
It is time for Israel to get serious about protecting its citizens; it is past time to wipe out ALL of Hamas, PLO, PLA, Islamic Jihad, within Israeli borders (including the so called West Bank and Gaza) etc.
There is room for your idea to also be implemented. I think more than the amount of land you noted should be taken for any future terrorist attacks.
Only when the terrorists realize they will lose in a drastic way if they continue terrorist acts will they even think about stopping the terror and bloodshed.
118 posted on 10/04/2003 11:59:29 AM PDT by DianaN (Eternal Freedom)
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To: Jeff Head; All
First, the terrorists would already be dead (blown up), secondly the terrorists would likely disassociate themselves from others for a period of time before committing the terror act (assuming they survive).

Secondly, terrorists are unlikely to be deterred by one kilometer of land being annexed as their hatred of Jews is stronger than any love of the land; indeed, as you may already know, many of the terrorists are NOT indigenous to the land anyway.

Thirdly, too many innocent Israeli lives would be lost in this slow scenario; it's past time for Israel to wipe out, in toto, those who have been warring against them for years. This includes Arafat, the PLO, the PLA, Islamic
Jihad, etc.

Fouth, the Arabs/Muslims would depend on the wretched UN to undo any annexation of land.

Back to the only realistic option: Wipe out those who have already declared war upon the State of Israel.

For those that remain, your idea is a good start, but more land must be annexed for any further attacks. Terrorists will not care about a kilometer of land so long as they can murder, especially murder Jews.

The terrorists plan on winning a war of attrition because they know they can win no other way.
119 posted on 10/04/2003 12:09:52 PM PDT by DianaN (Eternal Freedom)
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To: Jeff Head
This or another equally well thought out plan should be implemented. IMO it all starts with a 1000 pound WMD on the head of a certain terrorist of 55 years.

Starting with the failed 2000 peace accord, I would list the things Israel has done to try to develp peace between the two nations. I would mention that some of the west bank settlements were initiated to deprive the Palestinians of sniper locations, and that they know damn well why they were put there.

I would end up by introducing the plan you relate or another of equal validity.

By 24 hours I would preceed this by a direct Sharon to Bush conversation where I'd make it abundantly clear that Israel was going to declare war on terrorism too, and that the Bush administration had better be prepared to support it.

I don't like laying down the law to Bush, but dang it Bush has been laying down the law to Israel telling them what they will or won't do for his tenure as president. Before him other presidents have demanded Israel jump through hoops while allowing just about any activity out of the Palestinian camp. Bush himself has allowed the Palestinians to do as they please with absolutely no down-side.

This ends today! That's it from here.
122 posted on 10/04/2003 12:32:30 PM PDT by DoughtyOne
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To: Jeff Head
I personally like it, Jeff. I don't see that it has a chance of being implemented.
Notice, I didn't say it didn't have a chance of working, just no chance of being implemented.

For any plan of this sort to work there will have to be buy in from a majority of the existing Arab/muslim countries in the area.
No existing country is willing to take in the 'palestinians'. H*ll, most of the 'palestinians' came from Jordan initially.

I've given this some thought over the last few months. Here's what I have managed to read of the situation.

IMO, the wall that Isreal is implementing has a 50-50 chance of working well. How long can the 'palestinians' exist when cut off from the only country, Israel, that is willing to give them work or trade with them for anything?

For the Israeli security model to work, economic relations between Israel and 'palestine' will have to be ruptured. The idea of controlled movement of large numbers of workers, trucks and so on across the border is not compatible with the idea of the fence as a security barrier. Once movement is permitted, movement is permitted. Along with that movement will come guerrillas, weapons and whatever else anyone wants to send across. You cannot be a little bit pregnant on this: Either Israel seals its frontier, or the fence is a waste of steel and manpower. If the wall is not continual and unbreached, it may as well not be there.

If this goal is achieved, regardless of where the final line of the fence will be, then economic and social relations between Israel and 'palestine' will cease to exist except through third-party transit. Forgetting the question of Jerusalem -- for if Jerusalem is an open city, the fence may as well not be built, unless another fence is put around Jerusalem -- this poses a huge strategic challenge.

'Palestinians' historically have depended on Israel economically. If Israel closes off its frontiers, the only contiguous economic relationship will be with Jordan. In effect, 'palestine' would become a Jordanian dependency. However, it will not be clear over time which is the dog and which is the tail. Jordan already has a large 'palestinian' population that has, in the past, threatened the survival of the Hashemite Bedouin regime. By sealing off 'palestinian' and Israeli territories, the Israelis would slam 'palestine' and Jordan together. Over the not-so-long term, this could mean the end of Hashemite Jordan and the creation of a single Palestinian state on both sides of the Jordan River.
In this case the 'palestinians' could, in effect, take over the country of Jordan and become a true 'palestinian' country.

Two other scenarios exist. In one, the Hashemites survive and drive many of the 'palestinians' on the east bank of the Jordan into the West Bank; the Israelis maintain their cordon sanitaire and the 'palestinian' nation-state becomes an untenable disaster -- trapped between two enemies, Israel and Jordan. Israel would not object to this, but the problem is that the level of desperation achieved in 'palestine' might prove so chaotic that it either would threaten Israeli national security or set into motion processes in the Arab world -- and among Israel's Western allies -- that would increase pressure on Israel. In other words, the Israelis would wind up strategically where they started, with the non-trivial exception of fewer or no suicide bombings.

The other scenario is that the 'palestinians' do merge with Jordan, but -- given the dynamics of the Arab and Islamic worlds -- the new nation-state does not moderate but instead generates, with assistance from other Arabs, a major military strike force for whom the fence represents at most a minor tactical barrier rather than a strategic force. Under this scenario, the consequences would be a return to the strategic situation of 1948-1967 (except for Egypt's participation), with a potentially more powerful enemy to the east. If Egypt were to change its policies, the outcome could be strategically disastrous for Israel.

The fence strategy works only if the 'palestinian'-Jordanian relationship yields a politically moderate Palestinian state. That might happen, but there is no reason to be certain that it will. The essential purpose of the fence is to give Israel control of its security. The problem is that Israel can control the construction of the fence, but not the events after the fence is built. At some point in the process, Israel becomes dependent on the actions of others.

This is Israel's core strategic dilemma. At some point, no matter what it does, it becomes dependent on events that are not under its control.

As is the case in this world a lot of times, Israel does not have good choices. It has to make some bad ones work.

125 posted on 10/04/2003 1:33:12 PM PDT by Just another Joe (FReeping can be addictive and helpful to your mental health)
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To: Jeff Head
BTTT
130 posted on 04/17/2004 2:54:20 PM PDT by ApesForEvolution (FREE 3D Online Golf Game - Independent Reseller of the Week: http://egolfinternational.com/wig)
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