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To: betty boop; Alamo-Girl; unspun
Why is this so resisted?

Hi, bb!

The answer to your question, why folks avoid the discussion about the origins of the universe, and of life itself, is a bit lengthy but fairly obvious, IMO.

So far as I know (and no one has ever offered a third alternative) there are only two options for the beginning of our universe.

The universe was "created," or willed into being by Someone or Some Thing

or

The universe came into existence through some as yet unidentified cataclysmic cosmic accident.

Those are the only available options for the beginning of our universe. Obviously, each leads to a worldview quite opposed to the other. Each has it's problems, of course. Those who believe in a Creator have no widely accepted empirical evidence to support their view. On the other hand, those who believe in the alternative beginning of the universe have the impossible task of trying to show how all that we now know about that universe, and ourselves, came into being through a chain of accidental events. That is, how does purpose spring forth from purposelessness?

If anyone has a third alternative beginning, I would be quite interested in hearing about it.

421 posted on 06/08/2003 2:33:46 PM PDT by logos
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To: logos
That is, how does purpose spring forth from purposelessness?

That's not much of a problem if there is no purpose ;)

422 posted on 06/08/2003 2:39:36 PM PDT by general_re (ABSURDITY, n.: A statement or belief manifestly inconsistent with one's own opinion.)
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To: logos
Each has it's problems, of course. Those who believe in a Creator have no widely accepted empirical evidence to support their view.

Not only that, they have no ability to give the Putative Creator a reason for Her Urge.

On the other hand, those who believe in the alternative beginning of the universe have the impossible task of trying to show how all that we now know about that universe, and ourselves, came into being through a chain of accidental events. That is, how does purpose spring forth from purposelessness?

You're assuming that purpose has "sprung forth". Identify this "purpose". If you cannot do so, your argument is fatally flawed.

Those of us that contend the Universe is Causeless don't make the mistake of then claiming it has Purpose. Purpose can only be the result of deliberate Cause, and hence anyone assuming a Purpose while postulating the absence of Cause is confused.

550 posted on 06/09/2003 12:13:57 PM PDT by Ten Megaton Solution
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To: logos; betty boop; unspun
Thank you so much for your wonderful post!

The universe was "created," or willed into being by Someone or Some Thing

or

The universe came into existence through some as yet unidentified cataclysmic cosmic accident.

Those are the only available options for the beginning of our universe.

I would like to add that under the various multi-universe theories all that is being accomplished is moving the point at which there was a beginning. IOW, there is always a beginning.

577 posted on 06/09/2003 2:38:09 PM PDT by Alamo-Girl
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