Letter: Republicans Abroad in Israel to President Bush against Roadmap

IMRA | 5/27/2003 | Republicans Abroad in Israel

[LarryM]

Does Bush realize he is committing political suicide? If he does the summit and terrorist attacks follow, he has just joined the Clinton club. We've got to hope that he pulls back from this before it leads to disaster.

[rintense]

If I had a dime for everytime someone has said 'Bush is committing political suicide...'

[LarryM]

If I had a dime for everytime someone has said 'Bush is committing political suicide...'

Up to now, he's always made sure not to do something this stupid.

[SunStar]

Does Bush realize he is committing political suicide?

Actually, it is Sharon who is committing political suicide by supporting the "roadmap"...

[LarryM]

Everyone knows that Bush forced Sharon to accept the road map. Bush has now taken full ownership and will be held accountable by members of his political base if it fails.

[rintense]

My question is this: if the US- primarily President Bush, doesn't try to help with peace in Israel, who will? The UN? Yeah right. No one has been a bigger and better friend to Israel than the United States. And more recently, President Bush...

So let me ask you. What would *you* do to help achieve peace in the Israel? And I mean realistically. Sure, I'd like to blow the Palestinians off the planet too. But is that realistic? No.

[Jewels1091]

Why would you call it stupid?? Do you have the information that Bush has??? How do you know that Bush isn't going to go over there and tell them that Arafat has to go. How do you know that Bush isn't going to tell them that we will take care of their terrorist groups if they don't? How do you know that Bush isn't going to tell them, forget about pushing Israel into the sea, it ain't going to happen?? How do you know that Bush isn't going to tell them play ball, or we shut down the UN camps that your terroist groups are operating from?? Bush doesn't mince words and he is sick of Arafat running those people into the ground. Let's wait and see what happens before we say that Bush is doing something stupid. My trust in Bush hasn't been misplaced yet.

[Publius6961]

The onlysolution to the "palestinian" problem is relocation.

Facing this choice takes a lot more b***s than is currently fashionable, given the international PC mindset, universally among countries who do not (yet) experience the darker angels inherent in islam.

Population transfers are common, especially in the wake of wars. They have been practiced throughout history. In 1923, Greece and Turkey agreed to the resettlement of 2 million Greeks and 800,000 Turks; in 1945, the resettlement of 3 million Germans from Poland and Czechoslovakia was arranged. Following the collapse of its North African Empire, France accepted close to 1.5 million people. More than 12 million(!) Muslims and Hindus were exchanged between India and Pakistan. Israel has recognized this historical necessity. The "Arab Nation," with its enormous wealth and vast under-populated lands, has stubbornly refused to face facts.

It should have happened in 1948, right after the entire muslim world attacked the infant Israel.
It might have happened in the 50s.
It should have happened after the '67 war.

With each major conflict the problem grows bigger, but the basic solution does not change.
Do it now or do it later.

The longer it is put off, the bigger the conflict and the longer lasting its influence.

The determination of the muslim arabs to destroy the state of Israel is set, unyielding and will never change no matter how the Palestinian issue is resolved. Period.
Moving the palestinians as far away as possible is a slight amelioration of the problem for when the final blowup arrives.

[LarryM]

There is no solution to this problem at the current time. Just like there is no ready and easy solution to global Islamic terror. We dealt with the same situation with the Soviets. The only solution was to hold fast until the other side collapsed.

I personally think that Bush panicked after the Riyahd bombings. He is worried that attacks in the US will destroy his re-election chances (they won't) and has gone all-out to appease the Arabs. He hopes they will give him intelligence and will work against the terror networks in exchange for him selling out Israel to a PLO terror state.

He's totally wrong since the Arabs won't really cooperate and Arabs will continue their genocidal terror campaign against the Jews. Bush sold out his principles and integrity because he is very weak and afraid. If he had any guts, he would tell the Arabs that if they don't cooperate, they'll get the Saddam treatment. Instead he is pressuring the Jews. Very sad.

[carton253]

First of all, Bush is not committing political suicide.

Terrorist attacks will follow... but, the situation cannot stay as it is...

I do not agree with the timetable of the Roadmap, nor do I approve of a Palestinian state with its terror infrastructure in place.

Abu Mazen may be the necessary next step of wresting control from Arafat. Yes, I know that he is an Arafat co-hort, but he has displayed some independence. He wanted to take Barak's deal in 2000. Yes, I know some of the things that he has written... but, the new prime minister could not be a total dove and survive. If Abu Mazen is serious in wresting power away from Arafat, then Abu Mazen needs our support.

Furthermore, if Abu Mazen can wrest that power away from Arafat, then and only then, can he do anything about the terror infrastructure. Will he? We won't know until we get to that moment... but, a summit between Israel, the Palestinians and America will determine just how much support Mazen needs to do that and how serious he is to clean up the terror networks.

If Mazen is nothing more than an Arafat shill, these talks are in vain. But I don't think Mazen is an Arafat shill since Arafat is rumbling around trying to convince everyone he is still in charge. Why?

Islamic Jihad, Hamas, Fatah, et all will not take this lying down. They will attack since they want to stop the peace talks. If Mazen cracks down on them (no revolving prison door, etc) then there might be a chance for peace.

But, Mazen has to be supported until that day comes. This summit will determine whether Mazen should be backed.

Let's talk about American security. The Arabs have convinced the West (and the State Department) that the only reason there is discord in the Middle East is because of the Palestinian/Israeli conflict. Of course this is bull... The conflict has nothing to do with it. These guys hated each other long before the Balfour Doctrine... but you can't underestimate the impact it has in Middle East. Israel is the flashpoint. Palestinian "oppression" strengthens more than it weakens. The refugee camps (even though they are not Israel's fault) incite...

So, the President can let it fester and grow until the Middle East is engulfed in war once more.. or, he can slowly force all the governments in the Middle East to come join the rest of us in the 21st century.

The Israelis want peace. They have asked for America's help. Clinton sold them down the river. I don't think Bush will do that. The Israelis look to us... the Palestinians look to us. So, let's see what can be done. Who knows... maybe Mazen is on the up-and-up... Arafat will be truly sidelined... and the terror will be attacked.

Or, (and I lean more here) the Palestinian moderates will finally rise up and do battle against the extremists. It may take a Palestinian civil war to settle the issue.

But, Israel cannot continue to "occupy" (IDF currently locking down Palestinian towns) for years and years. It is damaging their economy. So, Israel needs a way out. In Bush, Sharon sees a partner. A strong partner who understands Israel's concerns and fears. I think the President is the right person for the task.

[LarryM]

The Israelis want peace. They have asked for America's help. Clinton sold them down the river. I don't think Bush will do that. The Israelis look to us... the Palestinians look to us. So, let's see what can be done. Who knows... maybe Mazen is on the up-and-up... Arafat will be truly sidelined... and the terror will be attacked

Clinton, rotten though he is, never pushed for a Palestinian State before the conflict was settled. Bush is doing exactly that. The rest of the stuff you are saying about Abu Mazen is pure fantasy.

But, Israel cannot continue to "occupy" (IDF currently locking down Palestinian towns) for years and years. It is damaging their economy. So, Israel needs a way out. In Bush, Sharon sees a partner. A strong partner who understands Israel's concerns and fears. I think the President is the right person for the task.

Israel has to continue to occupy these areas; otherwise they will be murdered. It's as simple as that. They can only release their grip when these ares are no longer terrorist bases. Bush is very frightened now and is worried about his re-election. It has affected his judgment.

[af_vet_1981]

What happened to President Bush in 1992 after he waged a political war against Israel ?

[bluecollarman]

Misunderestimate The "Game Inspired By A President"
Developed by Gamepart.com

[rintense]

Sorry, but I don't believe Bush puts his political concerns over the lives of people. As a matter of fact, some (including myself) believe he is risking his life by going to Jordan. And I don't believe he has done anything to appease the Arabs. In fact, if anything, he's pissed them off with:

1. Iraq
2. Hardline stance with Arafat
3. A growing hardline on Iran (though they aren't really Arab)
4. Lack of a hardline with Israel

Now, you need to break down who the Arabs are. The entire Mideast region, with the exception of the Hezbollah, Hamas, etc has been silent. And what do these groups have in common? They are terrorists. Period. They do not speak for the entire Arab region. So, in essence, Bush has pissed off the fundamentalists. Everyone else has given their silent support.

[rintense]

What? Are you're implying he lost re-election because of his stance with Israel?

[carton253]

It isn't as black and white and cut and dry as your answer to me would seem to indicate.

Maybe Mazen is nothing more than an Arafat shill. If that is true, then nothing is gained, and I do not believe the Road Map will go forward.

But up until now, I see that he is trying to wrest control away...but Arafat is not going "quietly into the night." No one expected him too. Arafat is the ultimate survivor. Do you honestly think because the President of the United States said he had to go that he would slink off the world stage?

No, he saw the prime minister's position as a way to keep power. So, up comes Mazen. Someone acceptable to both the extremists and the moderates.

Now that Mazen has the power and support of both Sharon and Bush, let's see what he will do. Let's see if Mazen wants peace. If the President goes to Jordan and determines that Mazen truly wants peace... then, let's support him. We owe Israel that much. A chance at peace.

But there are conditions on that support. Mazen has to attack the terror infrastructure. Not with words. Not with a 5% effort, but he has to attack it. If he does not, then the peace process won't go forward.

I have grave reservations about dealing with the Palestinians... But, if peace is going to come, then sooner or later, someone is going to have to take a chance for peace.

It seems to be one more time around the fence with the Palestinians who never made a promise they would keep. Yet, the Palestinians have paid a heavy price for their intifidah... let's see if any soberness have made it through their thick heads.

[rintense]

Excellent post.

[carton253]

Bush is very frightened now and is worried about his re-election. It has affected his judgment.

Man, what are you smoking? LOL!

[af_vet_1981]

First of all, Bush is not committing political suicide. Remains to be seen Terrorist attacks will follow... but, the situation cannot stay as it is... I tire of all the warnings about the Arab street. Where is a bulldozer when you need one ? I do not agree with the timetable of the Roadmap, nor do I approve of a Palestinian state with its terror infrastructure in place. Good Abu Mazen may be the necessary next step of wresting control from Arafat. Yes, I know that he is an Arafat co-hort, but he has displayed some independence. He wanted to take Barak's deal in 2000. Yes, I know some of the things that he has written... but, the new prime minister could not be a total dove and survive. If Abu Mazen is serious in wresting power away from Arafat, then Abu Mazen needs our support. Why should we support one terrorist over another ? Let the Palestinian people decide who their terrorist-in-chief is without our interference and then let the Bush doctrine apply. What is the Bush doctrine ? Good question. Does anyone know anymore ? Furthermore, if Abu Mazen can wrest that power away from Arafat, then and only then, can he do anything about the terror infrastructure. LOL Will he? ROFL We won't know until we get to that moment... FOMCROFL but, a summit between Israel, the Palestinians and America will determine just how much support Mazen needs to do that and how serious he is to clean up the terror networks. The brothers are not going to clean up the terror networks. If Mazen is nothing more than an Arafat shill, these talks are in vain. But I don't think Mazen is an Arafat shill since Arafat is rumbling around trying to convince everyone he is still in charge. Why? He is an aging terrorist who cannot stand to give up power, kind of like an aging rocker who won't give up the stage. Islamic Jihad, Hamas, Fatah, et all will not take this lying down. They will attack since they want to stop the peace talks. If Mazen cracks down on them (no revolving prison door, etc) then there might be a chance for peace. And if Senators Harkin and Daschle support Bush's right to pick judges we may have Judge Pickering. But, Mazen has to be supported until that day comes. Why exactly ? This summit will determine whether Mazen should be backed. Why, is he a good golfer ? Otherwise you could substitute any one of a plethora of Arab leaders and they would serve the same function. The only one who ever did anything about the terrorists is the late King Hussein of Jordan, and he is dead. Let's talk about American security. Okay, which infantry division do you wish to discuss ? The Arabs have convinced the West (and the State Department) that the only reason there is discord in the Middle East is because of the Palestinian/Israeli conflict. Of course this is bull... The conflict has nothing to do with it. These guys hated each other long before the Balfour Doctrine... but you can't underestimate the impact it has in Middle East. Israel is the flashpoint. Palestinian "oppression" strengthens more than it weakens. The refugee camps (even though they are not Israel's fault) incite... So, the President can let it fester and grow until the Middle East is engulfed in war once more.. or, he can slowly force all the governments in the Middle East to come join the rest of us in the 21st century. Makes a good movie, but in real life why not restore American dignity by conducting a tour of the American embassy in Teheran. Flyovers would be permitted. The Israelis want peace. They have asked for America's help. Clinton sold them down the river. I don't think Bush will do that. The Israelis look to us... the Palestinians look to us. So, let's see what can be done. Who knows... maybe Mazen is on the up-and-up... Arafat will be truly sidelined... and the terror will be attacked. And don't forget the Democrats. They are all patriots and partners for peace. It's true. I heard it on TV. Or, (and I lean more here) the Palestinian moderates will finally rise up and do battle against the extremists. It may take a Palestinian civil war to settle the issue. It would, but it is less likely than Tom Daschle becoming a Republican. But, Israel cannot continue to "occupy" (IDF currently locking down Palestinian towns) for years and years. Actually it could, one year at a time, as an alternative to ceasing to exist as a nation. It is damaging their economy. So, Israel needs a way out. In Bush, Sharon sees a partner. A strong partner who understands Israel's concerns and fears. I think the President is the right person for the task. "It's the economy stupid" is not the theme for the next election, but I suppose someone could try it. Maybe we will end up with a Democrat in the WH sooner than expected. What a sad thought. Why would the son repeat the mistakes of the father ?

[af_vet_1981]

Why yes, I am.