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Outsourcing hits US techies hard
Times of India ^ | MAY 26, 2003 | CHIDANAND RAJGHATTA

Posted on 05/26/2003 3:51:30 PM PDT by Lessismore

WASHINGTON: On a recent April afternoon in Silicon Valley, moments after he was told he had been laid off from his computer programming job at a Bank of America training centre, Kevin Flanagan stepped into the parking lot and shot himself dead.

Some of America's technology workers, who like Flanagan have also had to collect pink slips over the last several months, think they know why Flanagan took his life: Bank of America not only outsourced his job to India, but forced him to train Indian workers to do the job he had to give up.

In the weeks since his death, the techies have used the incident as fuel to fire a campaign against outsourcing to India, an issue that now seems poised to become a major sticking point between the two countries. Several US states are already considering legislation to ban or limit outsourcing.

Bank of America is one of several major US corporations – General Electric, Microsoft, Intel are among others - under scrutiny for outsourcing jobs to India. The Bank created what is called a "Global Delivery centre" in 2000 to identify projects that could be sent offshore.

Since then it has signed agreements with Infosys and Tata Consulting Services (TCS) to provide solutions and services.

In an e-mail exchange with this correspondent, Kevin's father Tom Flanagan said "a significant reason for which my son took his life was indeed as a result of his job being outsourced."

"Did he blame India for his job loss? No. He blamed the "system." He couldn't understand why Americans are losing jobs. Rather I should say he understood it economically, but not emotionally," Flanagan said.

Bank officials, who did not return calls relating to Flanagan's death, have said in the past that the deal with Indian companies would effect no more than 5 per cent of the bank's 21,000 employees, or about 1,100 jobs, in its technology and operations division.

According to some surveys, the US has lost at least 800,000 jobs in the past year and some 3.3 million jobs will move overseas over the next few years because of outsourcing, mostly to India.

The Bank has also acknowledged that it had asked local workers to train foreigners because such knowledge transfer was essential. According to Tom Flanagan, his son was "totally disgusted" with the fact that he and his fellow-workers had to train foreigners to do his job so they could take over. "That sir is a travesty," he said in one e-mail.

US tech workers are challenging the corporate world's claim that it is outsourcing work to improve bottomlines and efficiency. Some analysts have also pointed out that US corporations were being forced to tighten up by the same people who are moaning about outsourcing, and who, heavily invested in the stock market, demand better performance.

But on one website that discussed the Flanagan case, a tech worker pointed out that data processing consumed only a small per cent of revenues and was hardly a drain on the Bank's profit.

"(It is) a prosperous bank which has let greed trump any sense of patriotism or social responsibility," he fumed.


TOPICS: Front Page News
KEYWORDS: catholiclist; michaeldobbs
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To: BrooklynGOP
You are a NYer like me. There are still plenty of folks with "captive" jobs to buy MBs. Hell, here on Long Island, the public schoolteachers love them! Drive past a public school here, the parking lot is full of BMWs, MBs and Audis.
81 posted on 05/26/2003 5:06:14 PM PDT by oceanview
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To: Lurker
Another coward takes his own life rather than adapt to changing circumstances.

Yeah! Let the eat cake!

82 posted on 05/26/2003 5:06:20 PM PDT by FITZ
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To: YankeeReb
The follow may ring hollow to those affected directly by outsourcing but it is true.

In the sixties and seventies the Japanese targeted auto manufacturing. They became the best in the world at it and remain so to this day. Tens of thousands of American jobs went overseas during this period. At the time you could read stories just like this one only it concerned the trevails of auto workers.

But what happened after that? Americans developed from scratch the personal computer industry and the internet. None of the jobs currently going to India even existed when the Cassandras in the auto industry held sway.

Now India is targeting IT services. They will probably succeed in owning this global niche. But this does not spell doom for America. The strength of our economy has always been innovation. We develop whole industries from scratch. We reap the monopoly profits attendent to invention. Then as these industries mature, the rest of the world lives on the commodity production of these goods and services.

America will survive the loss of mature tech jobs. It will be painful for those affected directly. But the economy and the country will continue to grow in ways unimagined today.

P.S.

None of this excuses the criminal greed of many of our top CEOs. The millions of dollars stolen from shareholders and employees by these thieves is a real crime. The directors of these companies should be thrown in prison along with the executives. Come to think of it. That would not change very much. Members of these so-called independent boards are already grabbing their ankles and playing Betty to these executives.

83 posted on 05/26/2003 5:06:59 PM PDT by trek
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To: FR_addict
I want to enjoy life, but I can't. I worry everyday about my job, about finding a cheaper place to live, about how many extra hours do I have to put in to keep my job. I put in long hours every day and work every weekend so I haven't been able to go home, plus it's expensive to fly home. Managers are measuring how many hours are being worked rather than the quality of the work. The ones working are waiting for the axe to drop. There will be layoffs at my new job, either this week or next. We know this for sure, but we weren't told the size of the layoffs.

Dude. You just described my situation. 100%

84 posted on 05/26/2003 5:13:18 PM PDT by BrooklynGOP
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To: Incorrigible
When will the trend to outsource lawyers start?

I wanna know when will the trend to outsource CEO's start.

85 posted on 05/26/2003 5:14:28 PM PDT by Age of Reason
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To: oceanview
Not at all, I would consider doing that myself as a mid life job change if I was unable to hold/get my job in IT, but I may be too old.

Hey, I'm doing something similar and I'm in my 40s, but I have a lot of support from family or it would be impossible. The biggest handicap I find is that when employers see my past work history they figure I'll "leave when the economy turns around". It's a weird feeling.

86 posted on 05/26/2003 5:18:08 PM PDT by YankeeReb
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To: Tokhtamish
You got that right, watch Dean win the nomination, and the futz about CU's become so much noise, that the Dems can Drive a truck right up the economic middle.
87 posted on 05/26/2003 5:19:06 PM PDT by Vis Numar
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To: oceanview
That's funny. I work in LI. See plenty of mb's.
88 posted on 05/26/2003 5:19:25 PM PDT by BrooklynGOP
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To: RedBloodedAmerican
So, he's a victim because of outsourcing? What a crock.
He CHOSE to take a life. He COULD have looked for work elsewhere.
This article is a bunch of crap, only for the "**wahhhhh** we are getting outsourced" agenda.

I agree. This negativity and leftist brand of victimology is just sad.
Whatever happened to the American spirit that stands up to challenges and takes people through adversity and hard times?

We really don't need these doom and gloomers ruining the moral of everybody else.

89 posted on 05/26/2003 5:19:38 PM PDT by Jorge
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To: Lessismore
corporations follow cheap labor, the american way...
90 posted on 05/26/2003 5:20:45 PM PDT by Bill Davis FR
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To: Lessismore
These companies are going to come to regret much of this outsourcing... sooner or later all that confidential info that they are blindingly putting in the hands of foreigners is going to bite them big time....

Just an observation.
91 posted on 05/26/2003 5:23:33 PM PDT by HamiltonJay
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To: oceanview
Drive past a public school here, the parking lot is full of BMWs, MBs and Audis.

Your cops out there in Suffolk county are also the higest paid in the country, most making near six figures. OTOH property taxes are like a second mortgage payment on a modest house. But all that is the subject for another thread.

92 posted on 05/26/2003 5:24:50 PM PDT by YankeeReb
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To: Jorge
What do you do?
93 posted on 05/26/2003 5:25:07 PM PDT by BrooklynGOP
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To: HamiltonJay
These companies are going to come to regret much of this outsourcing... sooner or later all that confidential info that they are blindingly putting in the hands of foreigners is going to bite them big time....

Its not even that. Who'll be able to afford their product at current prices if we outsource all the jobs?

94 posted on 05/26/2003 5:25:57 PM PDT by BrooklynGOP
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To: oceanview
I agree that this is a hot domestic issue and I hope that the GOP responds to the problem before the Dems have a chance to pick it up and run with it.
As a very recently out-of-work s/w engineer, programming since 1983, I see the problem as three-fold:
1. The stock market dot.com crash (and general recession)
2. "Outsourcing" (unknown #, rumours of up to 1/3 of bay area jobs)
3. Hundreds of thousands of H1B visas issued over the last several years, (325,000+ foreign guest workers here).

When there is a shortage of engineers/programmers or whatever, outsourcing and H1B visas are acceptable. But, as there no longer appears to be a shortage, but rather a false surplus brought on by outsourcing and visas, then it should stop.
But how? I suppose OUR government could stop renewing and issuing visas, but I don't know how to stop outsourcing. It is apparently very economical for the U.S. corporations engaging in it. Although, I do have first-hand experience that the end quality will be significantly impaired. And I expect that goes for all jobs across the board, whether it is someone in Bombay answering my questions about my American Express card account or some code that is having problems getting integrated and working according to specifications.
Career changes at the level of experience and education required in high-tech will be painful. It will mean a lot of people will suddenly be paying a lot less income tax. It may result in an increase of "For Sale" signs in our neighborhoods very soon (if not already). It will be very distressing and disrupting for many Americans. And, it sure won't help the economy.
95 posted on 05/26/2003 5:27:16 PM PDT by LibertyAndJusticeForAll
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To: YankeeReb
they are indeed.

If you listen to Hannity's radio show, he pays $19,000/year in property taxes for his house (Syosset). Its not a modest home I am sure, but its not some palacial estate either.
96 posted on 05/26/2003 5:29:01 PM PDT by oceanview
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To: YankeeReb
Another thing I heard (maybe someone else knows more) is that in India, higher education is subsudized

You think it isn't here? Even at a private school, tuition doesn't pay all of the cost. At a public school, it typically and historically pays only about 1/3 of the cost. Although at first blush, subsidizing some fields more than others, in the sense of charging lower tuition or providing other stipends to the students, might seem like a good idea, do you really think the government is any better at knowing what educational backgrounds will be required more than others, 4 or 10 years hence, than students and/or their parents? If you do, there's a nice bridge in Brooklyn you might be interested in purchasing.

Government used to support engineering, math and hard sciences more than they do now, but that was mostly at the graduate level, and was predominately in the form of buying services from the grad students and their proffessors. That was mostly military, although NASA got in the act too. Now of course we spend most the federal budget on transfer payments, for which the taxpayers, as a group, get nothing in return.

97 posted on 05/26/2003 5:29:41 PM PDT by El Gato
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To: BrooklynGOP
I was laid off from an IT related position in 2000 (myself and about 40 others at the site). I started my own business after that.

It was that or shoot myself < /sarcasm >

98 posted on 05/26/2003 5:30:22 PM PDT by RedBloodedAmerican
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To: BrooklynGOP
FYI Orlando and Jacksonville is booming for programmers and IT folks.
99 posted on 05/26/2003 5:31:10 PM PDT by RedBloodedAmerican
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To: LibertyAndJusticeForAll
It will mean a lot of people will suddenly be paying a lot less income tax.

We see that already at the state level, Connecticut for example has been hit hard by loss of income tax revenue. I think that's a more accurate indicator of economic health than the unemployment figures, which don't take a lot of factors into account.

100 posted on 05/26/2003 5:31:11 PM PDT by YankeeReb
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