[watchin]

I see. In other words, it's always the man's fault.

You naively deny the possibility of a woman without a sex drive ... do you also deny the possibility of a man without a relationship clue? I thought not.

Your simple-minded advice will gain credibility the day you can preach it both ways. When you begin lecturing women because their men won't talk to them ... that all men want conversation with their wives... it's the her fault for not learning how to make conversation fulfilling for her husband ... if she would just stop being so selfish about their conversations - only concerned about her own fulfillment ... she allows the experience to remain less than fully satisfying - on the basis that - HE isn't interested in being satisfied. BS hun?

Why is it that women can believe in the possibility of a totally selfish man, but not a totally selfish woman?

[gatechie]

Actually men are much better communicators (as opposed to talkers - which women have cornered the market on). I come from a family with a lot of women in it and we constantly have 30 minute conversations and forget to make the decision on the main purpose for the call in the first place. Because men spend much more time the business world, they are better at cutting to the bottom line, getting their point across in 50 words or 1 minute which ever comes first. It is women that want men to guess what they want - to "know" by their mood (rather than a discussion) what is wrong or needed.

I have a house full of boys and they will stop in mid sentence and say - oh! an itch - mom scratch my back right here where I cannot reach it. My nieces on the other hand make remarks about their problem, but will never directly ask some one to help them. They try to talk them into offering to help. If one of my boys is offended by his brothers, he calls him a jerk straight to his face rather than plot secret revenge. My husband says he doesn't like certain foods, and that he prefer to never eat them whether ar a restaurant or at home without making it personal - it is me (and women in general) that take it personally.

He chastises me constantly that he cannot be held accountable for family policies that have not been presented to him. I spend too much money in clothes and he spends too much money on computers. WE are learning - I work on my female weaknesses and he works on his male weaknesses.

However, the fact that women have their own weaknesses doesn't give men a free pass to wallow in theirs without effort to improve. My husband reads computer magazines all the time in order to keep his skills sharp, but rolls his eyes at the mention of a book to keep our relationship working well. He doesn't think he needs a book to tell him how. (Women probably want men to read all of those books because they say what she isn't saying - and Kama Sutra might be an acceptable book for him reference on our strengthing our relationship.)

This story is about Double income-no sex marriages and women who aren’t interested. My advice was directed at men on how to get their wives interested. I am a wife and I know how my husband got me interested. It is not and never was a gripe session about how to manipulate men (my husband rules in this house) – but the truth is that men are usually more interested in keeping the frequency high to keep themselves satisfied rather than looking for ways to increase the frequency by making it more satisfying for her. I stick by my original points

1) if you do it right, she will chase you for it. 2) great sex covers a multitude of sins and although I didn’t say it originally – 3) if you are having sex with your wife mostly for your own satisfaction and her satisfaction is optional or irrelevant – it isn't much more than glorified m-bation.

A wise man seeks advice but a fool hates correction - don't be so busy defending yourself that you miss out on a chance to learn from others.