To: Jack of all Trades
I worked at International Fuel Cells for 5 years where I worked with phosphoric acid fuel cells (PAFCs) and molten carbonate fuel cells (MCFCs). I also had a short exposure to polymeric membrane fuel cells (or PEM fuel cells) at the Treadwell Corporation.
I mostly agree with the author of the article. Fuel cells are a wonderful specialty power source. They are perfect for situations where emmisions are a problem (Los Angeles busses, indoor applications, space applications, etc), where quiet operation is imperative (military applications), or where a source of hydrogen is readily available (industry).
However, as a primary engine for general use, such as automobiles, fuel cells are expensive, finicky, delicate, respond poorly to a need for acceleration power, are damaged by exposure to sub-freezing temperatures and have a limited life of less than five years.
You simply cannot beat the energy density and relatively cheap availability of gasoline, as well as the durability and responsiveness of an internal combustion engine.
Hopefully, only economics will force us to switch to another fuel for cars. If we do have to switch, it'll either be LNG, gasified coal or ethanol.
55 posted on
05/07/2003 1:09:32 PM PDT by
kidd
To: kidd
"You simply cannot beat the energy density and relatively cheap availability of gasoline, as well as the durability and responsiveness of an internal combustion engine. "
Exactly. Had hydrogen fueled vehicles and power plants been developed first, then oil, the environmentalists would be all for developing oil as a fuel souce. Pound for pound, can't beat it for portable energy source.
As I understand it, the best proposed source for hydrogen is...hydrocarbons...natural gas and gasoline. (I suppose if we could build a bunch of nuclear power plants, electrolysis of water would then be an alternative.)
Makes a lot of sense, doesn't it, to convert a supremely efficient energy source into a supremely inefficient source and call it progress.
87 posted on
05/07/2003 4:55:10 PM PDT by
Jesse
To: kidd
I worked at International Fuel Cells for 5 years where I worked with phosphoric acid fuel cells (PAFCs) and molten carbonate fuel cells (MCFCs). I also had a short exposure to polymeric membrane fuel cells (or PEM fuel cells) at the Treadwell Corporation. I mostly agree with the author of the article. Given your credentials, your points are WELL taken. I vote this the most sensible posted response!
102 posted on
05/07/2003 7:29:48 PM PDT by
WOSG
(Free Iraq! Free Cuba, North Korea, Syria, Iran, Lebanon, Tibet, China...)
To: kidd
Sounds like you worked on a lot of the stationary fuel cells for power generation at IFC. Were you ever involved with any of their automotive projects (the Hyundai engine, or the GM engines?).
" fuel cells are expensive, finicky, delicate, respond poorly to a need for acceleration power, are damaged by exposure to sub-freezing temperatures and have a limited life of less than five years"
A few thoughts from me on those points:
- Cost is reduced by volume production.
- A lot of delicate designs can be made robust over time.
- Most system designs for cars include 'peaking' batteries for acceleration
- Limited life is usually a materials and manufacturing cost issue
Fuel cells are just one power source choice in the emerging hybridized vehicles. The issues you point out are well known, and appear to be engineering issues, at least to me. Are there some tall pole barriers in any of these points that you could mention?
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