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To: general_re
But how can you know it's true if you can't prove it?
  1. I don't believe you're so ignorant of all the science behind modern nutritional knowledge as to believe that it's not based on evidence.

  2. You're asking someone else to "prove" something you already believe to be a proven fact. That is the clearest example of 'obfuscation' I've ever seen. You're clearly just trying to deflect the question.

330 posted on 05/01/2003 8:30:23 PM PDT by Dominic Harr
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To: Dominic Harr
It's not really a matter of whether or not eating cake is healthy or not - let's think back to how all this got started, so I can get you to properly understand my point. The question is not whether eating cake is healthy or not, the question is "does it really make sense to say that some personal preferences are objectively 'better' than others?" And we looked at that in terms of whether or not hedonism is objectively better or worse than some other choice, such as the sort of hedonism that might cause someone to consume nothing but Twinkies and Yoo-hoo.

So now, you've asserted that this kind of hedonism is objectively worse than some other lifestyle. And my question is, very simply, why? Why is it objectively bad to eat nothing but Twinkies and Yoo-hoo? And the answer I get is that it's bad because it's unhealthy. So then my next question is, why is being healthy objectively better than being unhealthy? And so far, I haven't gotten a coherent answer to that. But that's okay - there really isn't a coherent answer to it, because it's not a question of objective fact at all, it's a question of values, and what one's personal preferences are. And those are inherently subjective. You value health over the pleasure of eating Twinkies, and so you tend to think of health as the "rational" choice. But someone else might value the pleasure of eating shitty junk food over health, and thus view eating Twinkies as the rational choice, and view the pursuit of that pleasure as being in their own self-interest - which, of course, it is.

Personal preferences. Values choices. This is the language of subjective judgement, Dom, and no matter how hard you try, you can't glue that to a basis in objective fact - people's personal values and preferences just don't work that way. Whatever I happen to value, whatever my interests are, pursuing that is my self-interest, and trying to argue otherwise is just you substituting your choices for mine, and arguing that your subjective preferences are "objectively" better than mine.

337 posted on 05/01/2003 8:49:07 PM PDT by general_re (Take care of the luxuries and the necessities will take care of themselves.)
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