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Santorum is Right
AgapePress ^ | April 25, 2003 | R. Cort Kirkwood

Posted on 04/26/2003 6:24:52 AM PDT by Remedy

Sen. Rick Santorum, Republican from Pennsylvania, is now likened to Sen. Trent Lott.

Santorum has upset the homosexuals, and they expect the GOP to dump their No. 3 senator. What happens remains to be seen, but the one thing Santorum must not do is apologize.

Several reasons come to mind, not least of which is that he's right.

What He Said
Referring to a U.S. Supreme Court case that will decide the "constitutionality" of Texas' sodomy law, Santorum, an orthodox Catholic, remarked thusly:

"If the Supreme Court says that you have the right to consensual [gay] sex within your home, then you have the right to bigamy, you have the right to polygamy, you have the right to incest, you have the right to adultery. You have the right to anything."

Within minutes, a mouthpiece from the disingenuously named Human Rights Campaign, a lobby group for sodomy, was on the blower with the newspapers: "It is stunning, stunning in its insensitivity," David Smith told the Philadelphia Inquirer. "Putting homosexuality on the same moral plane as incest is repulsive."

A Santorum spokeswoman rushed to answer: "[She] said yesterday that Santorum had no problem with gay relationships. 'Sen. Santorum was specifically speaking about the right to privacy within the context of the Supreme Court case,' she said, explaining that he did not want to elevate gay sex to the level of a constitutional right."

Commented Howard Kurtz in The Washington Post, "At least Trent Lott had the good sense to apologize."

The Real Problems
If you want to know what's wrong here, look beyond Santorum. First look to the Supreme Court, which has no role here. The Texas law is "constitutional" because it's none of the federal government's business, regardless of what high court "precedent" says.

If Santorum were smart, he'd be working to undo the 75 years of unconstitutional "civil rights" jurisprudence and legislation that permits the Supreme Court to decide these things.

Second, of course Santorum has "a problem with gay relationships." If one form of extra-marital sex is permissible, Santorum essentially said, all of it is. This is what faithful Catholics like Santorum believe. And that, not politically organized sodomites, Kurtz and others gallingly suggest, is what's wrong.

Citing the AP follow, Kurtz quotes Santorum, then adds a snippy, fallacious analogy: Santorum has "'no problem with homosexuality -- I have a problem with homosexual acts.' Boy, that oughta make everyone feel better. Kind of like saying you have no problem with disabled folks, it's just those blasted wheelchairs."

No, it's not like saying that, but regardless, Santorum is right again. Love the sinner; hate the sin. It's standard Christian teaching. And that, again, is the real evil in this topsy-turvy morality play.

Why He's Right
Now, let's grab the nettle:

"Putting homosexuality on the same moral plane as incest is repulsive," says the professional homosexual. Really?

I'd describe what homosexuals do in detail, but it's so repulsive I'll let readers look into it. They can decide whether anal intercourse is repulsive, or whether a three-man orgy in a bathhouse is morally equivalent to a married man and woman making new life.

Homosexual sodomy, an objectively disordered act, is on the same moral plane as incest. It is a mortal sin, all of which are repulsive to Christians and not only send the unrepentant to Hell but also poison society.

Explanations and apologies didn't help Lott. They won't help Santorum.


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Crime/Corruption; Culture/Society; Foreign Affairs; Government; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: homosexualagenda; homosexuality; houston; santorum; sodomy; sodomylaws; texas
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To: 11th Earl of Mar
If adultery is illegal? Are they prosecuting it?

Yes, by state, and Yes, irregularly. The state doesn't decide if they prosecute adultery without insistance from one of the married couple.

I believe most cases of adultery do not include jail time, but a punitive fine.

Please, I am a Libertarian, I support wide-spread prosecution of adultery because it represents a breach of contract...a quite severe one because it most often represents not only a breach of a secular contract, but also a breach of a sacred contract.

However, by concentrating on the adultery comments made by Santorum, you've made your argument unique, but have not elevated it above the combination of nit-picking and hair-splitting that it represents.
81 posted on 04/26/2003 10:02:55 AM PDT by Maelstrom (To prevent misinterpretation or abuse of the Constitution:The Bill of Rights limits government power)
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To: lawdude

Why is it ok to be 'insensitive' to Christians but no other "group"? Of course, by asking the question I may seem to be agreeing that his comments WERE insensitive, which I do not.

I imagine the Jews posed the same question in Europe 65 years ago, and some (in Israel) may pose the same question today.

  1. Freedom of Speech
  2. Christians turn the other cheek(s).
  3. Limp-wristed, victimized homos prevail over spinless, propagandized Republicans everytime.
  4. GOV : The Godless Party: Media Bias & Blindness—And the Big Story They Missed
  5. Fascism, corruption and my 'Democratic' Party

 

 

82 posted on 04/26/2003 10:04:16 AM PDT by Remedy
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To: sinkspur
gay consensual sex

No such thing. Defined in terms of biological FACT, sex only occurs with a penis and a vagina. Fellatio, cunnilingus, sodomy, etc., are human perversions of anatomical function and reproductive biology...

Let's examine the scientific facts, not the rhetoric of psychotic perverts.

83 posted on 04/26/2003 10:04:42 AM PDT by Sir Francis Dashwood (LET'S ROLL!)
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To: sinkspur
Center for Arizona Policy The APA's brief cites to Laumann et al. to support their statement that the sexual practices prohibited by the Texas law "are important aspects of sexual intimacy for many American heterosexual couples." APA Br. at 21. However, Laumann's study specifically reveals that oral sex is "a technique with which most people have at least some familiarity, but it has in no sense become a defining feature of sex between women and men (as vaginal intercourse or, perhaps, kissing is) . . . it is important to establish at the outset the ambiguity of oral sex in the repertoire of [heterosexual] techniques." Laumann et al., supra, at 101.

Laumann's research also reveals that heterosexuals engage in anal sex even less than oral sex: "anal sex has not entered into the repertoire of regular sexual practices of most women and men in the United States." Laumann, supra, at 107. This study found that only one-quarter of men and one-fifth of women have experienced anal sex over a lifetime, and is far less frequent than that in any given year of life. Id. Heterosexuals were also 79% less likely to find anal intercourse as "very appealing" compared to vaginal intercourse. Laumann et al., supra, at 152-155, Table 4.2.

Because oral and anal sex are primary means of sexual activity between individuals of the same sex (APA Br. at 22-23), and such is not the case with heterosexual couples, it should be considered that the Texas law has reasonably and narrowly drawn their prohibition of "deviate sexual intercourse" to those couples where it is most likely to take place. The Texas law may also contemplate the higher rates of sexually transmitted diseases which are related to certain sexual behaviors, and seeks to prohibit behavior associated with a higher prevalence of sexually transmitted infections (not only HIV/ AIDS) and sexually associated infections and other illnesses. Laumann et al., supra, at 396.

It is well-documented that as the number of sexual partners rise, the likelihood of having a partner with a sexually transmitted infection also rises. Laumann et al., supra, at 403; see generally Hickson et al., supra. As has been noted, homosexuals have a much greater number of sexual partners, 23 as compared to heterosexuals, and engage in sexually riskier activity, 24 therefore, there are serious health considerations implicated in same-sex sexual activity which should be taken into account when a legislature proscribes certain sexual activities.

84 posted on 04/26/2003 10:07:24 AM PDT by Remedy
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To: Sir Francis Dashwood
Fellatio, cunnilingus, sodomy, etc., are human perversions of anatomical function and reproductive biology...

And should be criminalized?

85 posted on 04/26/2003 10:07:29 AM PDT by sinkspur
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To: Sir Francis Dashwood
BUMP!
86 posted on 04/26/2003 10:08:31 AM PDT by Remedy
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To: sinkspur
SODOMY : World AIDS Day: Reflections on the Pandemic
87 posted on 04/26/2003 10:10:12 AM PDT by Remedy
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To: 11th Earl of Mar
If you don't think that Santorum was referring to 'gay' sex in his comments about the Supreme Court's ruling on homosexual issues, you are completely clueless.

This is what Santorum said:

"If the Supreme Court says that you have the right to consensual sex within your home, then you have the right to bigamy, you have the right to polygamy, you have the right to incest, you have the right to adultery."

The case before the Supreme Court involves homosexuals violating a sodomy law. If court rules the sodomy law is unconstituional because it involves consensual sex on private property, how can a bigamy or adultery or incest law be constitutional?

88 posted on 04/26/2003 10:11:25 AM PDT by Tribune7
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To: Remedy
So heterosexual sodomy is OK, but homosexual sodomy is not, according to what you posted.

I'm surprised that law is constitutional, even in Texas.

89 posted on 04/26/2003 10:14:20 AM PDT by sinkspur
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To: Tribune7
If court rules the sodomy law is unconstituional because it involves consensual sex on private property, how can a bigamy or adultery or incest law be constitutional?

Consensual sex between two unmarried adults violates no one else's rights, unlike bigamy and adultery, both of which violate the very public institution of marriage.

90 posted on 04/26/2003 10:16:26 AM PDT by sinkspur
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To: sinkspur
Since you're throwing out the moral considerations,...

Plato's Euthyphro and Apology are a great illustration...

Socrates advances the argument to Euthyphro that, piety to the gods, who all want conflicting devotions and/or actions from humans, is impossible.

Likewise, morals are such a construction of idols used by the Left as a rationale for them to demand compliance to their wishes in politics, which most often are a skewed mess of fallacies in logic. Morals are a deceptive replacement for the avoidance of sin. If a person believes in a God, it is the conviction of the Holy Ghost by which they are guided and not by the idolatrous vanities of morals constructed by others.

Plato's Apology is a drama that portrays the current Left wing frustration with Rick Santorum. The people of Athens (the Left) are demanding that Socrates (Santorum) be silent. Socrates refuses and the elite of Athens demand the execution of Socrates. The modern Left wants a figurative execution of Rick Santorum and others like him (although 'figurative' would be quickly made actual if the Left ever had the unchecked power they desire).

Considering that 90% of people tend to be more influenced by the visual, television has become a new religion. It is analagous to Plato's cave allegory. Television as a propaganda tool helps create visual phantasms (or as Thomas Hobbes called them, 'phantastical images') of the brain.

There are three ways people are influenced according to the school of behavioral psychology - - visual (sight), auditory (sound), kinesthetic (emotion). The kinesthetic or 'feeling' is also based on olfactory and tactile sense, much like Pavlov's salivating dogs. Visual images and sound portrayed can be used to anchor emotional and/or conditioned responses desired by those that present them, which in the case of television, is the Leftist television media, actors who create phantastical images in film, and Leftist politicians who pander to symbolism over substance (like Rush always says about them).

The visual aspect of that phenomenon is also used by the print media to a degree. Interactve talk radio requires thought, television does not and relies on this as a means to influence viewers...

They worship for gods 'those appearances that remain in the brain from the impression of external bodies upon the organs of their senses, which are commonly called ideas, idols, phantasms, conceits, as being representations of those external bodies which cause them, and have nothing in them of reality, no more than there is in the things that seem to stand before us in a dream...'

Like the necromancy of the Wellstone funerally, the use of Martin Luther King Day, or constantly invoking the "spirit of the '60's," the Left attempts to raise spirits of the dead as a totem for worship.

Such is the same concerning the "gay" religion. The public is expected to bow down to their idolatry of perversions. Sorry, I don't buy it...

-

Should that be equated with "man-on-dog" as well?

I don't care...

91 posted on 04/26/2003 10:16:54 AM PDT by Sir Francis Dashwood (LET'S ROLL!)
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To: Sir Francis Dashwood
Well, thanks for the preachment, but I'm not sure it's apropos of anything I've said.
92 posted on 04/26/2003 10:20:03 AM PDT by sinkspur
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To: sinkspur
And should be criminalized?

Should it be idolized?

93 posted on 04/26/2003 10:21:49 AM PDT by Sir Francis Dashwood (LET'S ROLL!)
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To: Remedy
Yes he was and is. Freep poll at Should Santorum quit?
94 posted on 04/26/2003 10:22:06 AM PDT by Kay Soze (For every 100 Osamas created in the fight on terrorism - we shall simply elect one more "W")
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To: sinkspur
Tell me how consensual polygyny or consensual polyandry violates anyone's rights?
95 posted on 04/26/2003 10:25:08 AM PDT by Sir Francis Dashwood (LET'S ROLL!)
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To: sinkspur
And bigamy and adultery are breach of the legal contract of marriage.
Incest laws were originally put in to keep the couple from having genetically defective kids, not for some grand moral posture. Many royal families routinely married siblings and close cousins and ended up with messed up offspring.
And pedophilia and bestiality are off-limits because there can be no proper consent to the act by a child or an animal.

None of these issues apply to consenting adult gays in the privacy of their own homes. They are consenting, non-contracted, and non-reproductive.

Santorums analogy, even when examined from a legal perspective and eliminating the moral view (difficult around here) was a bad one.

LQ
96 posted on 04/26/2003 10:26:38 AM PDT by LizardQueen
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To: Sir Francis Dashwood
Should it be criminalized, or can't you answer the question?
97 posted on 04/26/2003 10:38:02 AM PDT by sinkspur
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To: sinkspur
Consensual sex between two unmarried adults violates no one else's rights, unlike bigamy and adultery, both of which violate the very public institution of marriage.

Well,how do you feel about polygamy or incest then? You think a divorced fellow should be allowed to marry his daughter? The age of consent is 14 in Hawaii.

98 posted on 04/26/2003 1:02:50 PM PDT by Tribune7
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To: Sir Francis Dashwood; sinkspur
sinkspur:
And should be criminalized?


Should it be idolized?
93 -Sir Francis Dashwood-


Neither, - both obviously & constitutionally.
- 'Consensual & private adult sex' should be ~ignored~ by government.

As sinky says, very weak cases on 'contract' enforcement can be made for state laws on bigamy, adultry, incest, etc, so such 'crime' could safely be resolved by juries informed of their constitutional nullification option.
99 posted on 04/26/2003 1:49:48 PM PDT by tpaine (Really, I'm trying to be a 'decent human being', but me flesh is weak.)
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To: LizardQueen
And you think your too-clever-by-half absurd exyensions will obfuscate the issue as it has arisen?... Sheez, don't bother posting such drivel if you wish to carry on rational discussion. On the other hand, if all you seek to do is obscure the realities, then knock yourself out, Lizard.
100 posted on 04/26/2003 2:05:35 PM PDT by MHGinTN (If you can read this, you've had life support from someone. Promote Life Support for others.)
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