[Republican Party Reptile]

PatrioticAmerican sez ...

"Many that made $60-80K are now happy to have $40K. Last year, I did a large project and got high end developers for $50K, and they were real happy to have the jobs. One guy just took a $40K job, and he's 42 with 20 years experience. We seriously need to review the H1-B program and the offshore developments.

So ... did you had any influence on the rate paid to developers on the proejct? And if you did, and if you think the pay scale is presently unfairly depressed, why didn't you pay them 60K to 80K instead of paying them only 50K or 40K for a guy with 20 years of exp?

Has the availability of larger pool of highly skilled workers at a lower rate been helpful to your project?

It;s a bit vertigo inducing to hear you complaining about H1Bs drivng down market rate when at the same time you also actively participate in taking advantage of the lower market rate to offer more attractive bid on projects with lower development cost and get talent for what less than what you think they are worth.

[Billy_bob_bob]

I suppose you'll be as enthusiastic about H1-b's when it's your job that gets hit. Do you like the idea of having to learn more and more, and having to work harder and harder for the privilege of earning less and less? Because that is what it is like for engineers, and I for one am sick of it.

Really, what do YOU do for a living?

[PatrioticAmerican]

"So ... did you had any influence on the rate paid to developers on the proejct? And if you did, and if you think the pay scale is presently unfairly depressed, why didn't you pay them 60K to 80K instead of paying them only 50K or 40K for a guy with 20 years of exp? "

Market, buddy, market. When the client cuts the pay to the company, the company must cut the pay to the staff. Simple economics,and, no, the company didn't realize any higher profit.

What used to be $1 mill contracts are now going for $250-$400k.

[PatrioticAmerican]

P.S. We gave the staff one months bonus for completing on time. We also we able to ensure two hired on with the client, 4 got jobs elsewhere, and only two had to be let go, of which our corporate office hired one and I got a job a few months later for another. I actually gave him a job that was offered to me.

[PatrioticAmerican]

"Has the availability of larger pool of highly skilled workers at a lower rate been helpful to your project?"

Any project does better with better people. The market caused our pay scale. We had plenty to chose from, and I was VERY open about the opportunity and what it entailed. We had a great team. They all put out and did their best. The engagement was very sucessful, and we bent over backwards to see to it that the team was taken care of to the best of anyone's ability.

[PatrioticAmerican]

"It;s a bit vertigo inducing to hear you complaining about H1Bs drivng down market rate when at the same time you also actively participate in taking advantage of the lower market rate to offer more attractive bid on projects with lower development cost and get talent for what less than what you think they are worth."

Actually, you got that logic completely wrong. We didn't take advantage of the developers, our client did. They knew they could hold us to a given price because what were we to do, turn down the job??

Now the punch line: We displaced an H1-B and offshore Indian company. They sucked, did a lousy job, and they were charging and arm and a leg. That's right, we displaced an Indian firm.

The Americans did a FAR better job at half the cost. That's right, again, HALF the cost. The client had only a few bucks left and the indian company wasn't going to finish on time or budget. They were already 300% over budget.

More and more companie are finding that the Indian firms suck. They charge far more than they are worth. They usually use six week wonders to do the coding, and it shows. They change control everything into cost overruns. They also have an extremely top heavy managment style, and they can't spell in English worth a damn.