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To: nolu chan
Lincoln DID call a special secession of Congress.

You made a false statement, and you don't seem to have a really good grasp of these events. You seem to be P/O'd at FDR, and you've transferred that angst back to poor old Father Abraham.

You said a while back that the EP freed no slaves -- that Lincoln "freed" slaves where he had no power and left slaves alone where he did have power. This is often seen, and always wrong. Anyone who read a survey history of the war would know that. Now you say that President Lincoln didn't declare war. That same survey or general history of the war that you never read would have told you that President Lincoln's position was that no state could get out of the Union and that secession ordinances were null and void. That is what he said in his inaugural address.

You don't seem to know the history.

Go read a good single volume history of the war and then get back to me.

Walt

724 posted on 05/01/2003 1:29:11 PM PDT by WhiskeyPapa (Be copy now to men of grosser blood and teach them how to war!)
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To: WhiskeyPapa
[Wlat] Lincoln DID call a special secession of Congress.

[Wlat] You made a false statement, and you don't seem to have a really good grasp of these events.

He did not call a secession of Congress at all. What did Congress secede from? You do not seem to have a good grasp of reality.

He did not call a special session either, at least not during the first six weeks of his administration.

[Wlat] Go read a good single volume history of the war and then get back to me.

I have not been discussing the war. I have been discussing the law as it applied to the actions of Lincoln and his administration. Go buy a good law book and get back to me. Let me help. Try B&N down around Union Square. You can take the 8th Ave line to within walking distance. Go in the big building with the textbooks. Go all the way through to the opposite corner of the building. If you are lucky, you will find a room full of legal texts.


733 posted on 05/01/2003 2:10:45 PM PDT by nolu chan
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To: WhiskeyPapa
[Walt] You seem to be P/O'd at FDR, and you've transferred that angst back to poor old Father Abraham.

I'm not po'd at either FDR or Abe. Your defense of many Lincoln administration actions is that he was an honorable man with good intentions. My objection is that the office is not reserved for honorable men and there can be no "honorable man" exemption.

The law applies to the office - without regard for whether the occupant of the office has honorable intent.
743 posted on 05/01/2003 3:17:12 PM PDT by nolu chan
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To: WhiskeyPapa
National Archives and Records Administration

http://www.archives.gov/exhibit_hall/featured_documents/emancipation_proclamation/

The Emancipation Proclamation

President Abraham Lincoln issued the Emancipation Proclamation on January 1, 1863, as the nation approached its third year of bloody civil war. The proclamation declared "that all persons held as slaves" within the rebellious states "are, and henceforward shall be free."

Despite this expansive wording, the Emancipation Proclamation was limited in many ways. It applied only to states that had seceded from the Union, leaving slavery untouched in the loyal border states. It also expressly exempted parts of the Confederacy that had already come under Northern control. Most important, the freedom it promised depended upon Union military victory.

Although the Emancipation Proclamation did not immediately free a single slave, it fundamentally transformed the character of the war.

* * *

The Emancipation Proclamation
January 1, 1863

A Transcription

By the President of the United States of America:

A Proclamation.

Whereas, on the twenty-second day of September, in the year of our Lord one thousand eight hundred and sixty-two, a proclamation was issued by the President of the United States, containing, among other things, the following, to wit:

"That on the first day of January, in the year of our Lord one thousand eight hundred and sixty-three, all persons held as slaves within any State or designated part of a State, the people whereof shall then be in rebellion against the United States, shall be then, thenceforward, and forever free; and the Executive Government of the United States, including the military and naval authority thereof, will recognize and maintain the freedom of such persons, and will do no act or acts to repress such persons, or any of them, in any efforts they may make for their actual freedom.

"That the Executive will, on the first day of January aforesaid, by proclamation, designate the States and parts of States, if any, in which the people thereof, respectively, shall then be in rebellion against the United States; and the fact that any State, or the people thereof, shall on that day be, in good faith, represented in the Congress of the United States by members chosen thereto at elections wherein a majority of the qualified voters of such State shall have participated, shall, in the absence of strong countervailing testimony, be deemed conclusive evidence that such State, and the people thereof, are not then in rebellion against the United States."

Now, therefore I, Abraham Lincoln, President of the United States, by virtue of the power in me vested as Commander-in-Chief, of the Army and Navy of the United States in time of actual armed rebellion against the authority and government of the United States, and as a fit and necessary war measure for suppressing said rebellion, do, on this first day of January, in the year of our Lord one thousand eight hundred and sixty-three, and in accordance with my purpose so to do publicly proclaimed for the full period of one hundred days, from the day first above mentioned, order and designate as the States and parts of States wherein the people thereof respectively, are this day in rebellion against the United States, the following, to wit:

Arkansas, Texas, Louisiana, (except the Parishes of St. Bernard, Plaquemines, Jefferson, St. John, St. Charles, St. James Ascension, Assumption, Terrebonne, Lafourche, St. Mary, St. Martin, and Orleans, including the City of New Orleans) Mississippi, Alabama, Florida, Georgia, South Carolina, North Carolina, and Virginia, (except the forty-eight counties designated as West Virginia, and also the counties of Berkley, Accomac, Northampton, Elizabeth City, York, Princess Ann, and Norfolk, including the cities of Norfolk and Portsmouth[)], and which excepted parts, are for the present, left precisely as if this proclamation were not issued.

And by virtue of the power, and for the purpose aforesaid, I do order and declare that all persons held as slaves within said designated States, and parts of States, are, and henceforward shall be free; and that the Executive government of the United States, including the military and naval authorities thereof, will recognize and maintain the freedom of said persons.

And I hereby enjoin upon the people so declared to be free to abstain from all violence, unless in necessary self-defence; and I recommend to them that, in all cases when allowed, they labor faithfully for reasonable wages.

And I further declare and make known, that such persons of suitable condition, will be received into the armed service of the United States to garrison forts, positions, stations, and other places, and to man vessels of all sorts in said service.

And upon this act, sincerely believed to be an act of justice, warranted by the Constitution, upon military necessity, I invoke the considerate judgment of mankind, and the gracious favor of Almighty God.

In witness whereof, I have hereunto set my hand and caused the seal of the United States to be affixed.

Done at the City of Washington, this first day of January, in the year of our Lord one thousand eight hundred and sixty three, and of the Independence of the United States of America the eighty-seventh.

By the President: ABRAHAM LINCOLN
WILLIAM H. SEWARD, Secretary of State.

744 posted on 05/01/2003 3:34:22 PM PDT by nolu chan
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