***Operation Iraqi Freedom - Situation Room - Day 21 - LIVE THREAD***

Multiple ^ | April 9, 2003 | Various

[An.American.Expatriate]

Operation Iraqi Freedom

This thread is dedicated to the brave men and women of the

 Armed Forces of the United States of America.

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"Wish You Were Here"

For all the free people that still protest.
You're welcome. We protect you and you are protected by the best.
Your voice is strong and loud,
but who will fight for you? No one standing in your crowd.
We are your fathers, brothers, and sons,
wearing the boots and carrying guns.
We are the ones that leave all we own,
to make sure your future is carved in stone.
We are the ones who fight and die,
We might not be able to save the world, Well, at least we try.
We walked the paths to where we are at
and we want no choice other than that.
so when you rally your group to complain,
take a look in the back of your brain.
In order for that flag you love to fly
wars must be fought and young men must die.
We came here to fight for the ones we hold dear.
If that's not respected, we would rather stay here.
So please stop yelling, put down your signs,
and pray for those behind enemy lines.
When the conflict is over and all is well,
be thankful that we chose to go through hell.

Corporal Joshua Miles and all the boys from 3rd Battalion 2nd Marines,
Kuwait 3/9/2003

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Links to the past threads

Day 1	Day 8	Day 15
Day 2	Day 9	Day 16
Day 3	Day 10	Day 17
Day 4	Day 11	Day 18
Day 5	Day 12	Day 19
Day 6	Day 13	Day 20
Day 7	Day 14

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Mhking's live cam links 

Live Video/Audio Feeds: (If you can't reach a feed by clicking on it, make sure to try copying the address, and pasting it in the appropriate browser -- WMV=Windows Media Player; Real=Real Player/RealOne; MP3=WinAmp/Audion/other streaming MP3 player; QT=QuickTime) FR: Final Update: Streaming Video/Audio Links (Includes info & HTML/Javascript code on how to create your own multi-feeds page)
"Mother Of All War Websites" (Additional links to live audio/video feeds)
VirtualTuner.com - Showdown in Iraq
WWI-TV Portal (WorldWide Internet-TV Portal Site)
Abu Dhabi TV (Real - Arabic)
BBC/Baghdad Cam(Real)
BBC News 24 (Real - 56)
BBC News 24 (Real - BB)
CablePulse 24 - Toronto (WMV)
CBS/Baghdad Cam (Real)
CBC RadioOne - Toronto (QT)
CN8 Philadelphia (Real)
CNN+ (Spain) (WMV)
CNN Baghdad Cam (WMV)
CNN Radio (WMV)
CNN via KGW/Portland (Real - mostly down)
DW-TV Berlin (Real - German/English)
IraqiTV (Real)
IraqiTV (WMV - #1)
IraqiTV (WMV - #2)
IraqiTV (WMV - #3)
ITN News Channel - London (Real - Audio Only)
MSNBC/NBC (WMV/Feeds page)
MSNBC (WMV - Audio Only - Headlines & Breaking News)
MSNBC Bagdad Cam (WMV)
N-TV Berlin (Real - In German Where Available)
NTV Baghdad Cam (Real)
NWCN, Seattle/Portland (Real)
Reuters Feedroom (Real - Raw Video Feeds)
Sky News (56K - WMV/Copy/Paste)
Sky News (BB - WMV/Copy-Paste)
SNN6 Sarasota, FL (Real)
WSVN-TV/DT Miami (WMV - Fox Affiliate)

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Cboldt's Goody Bag

Baghdad City Maps

http://www.lib.utexas.edu/maps/middle_east_and_asia/baghdad_nima_2003.jpg <-- 1.6 Mb
http://www.stripes.com/02/dec02/baghdad.pdf <-- 440 Kb

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Good Morning.

This is the Daily Thread of Operation Iraqi Freedom - Situation Room - LIVE THREAD.

It is designed for general conversation about the events of the day. In depth discussion of events should be left to individual threads - but links to the threads or other articles is highly encouraged. This allows us to stay abreast of the situation in general, while also providing a means of obtaining specific information.

Please have mercy on us dial up limited FReepers! Limit the big graphics, post links instead. A brief description of what the graphic is would help!  If you post graphics, please "size" them so that our browsers continue to load the rest of the thread!

< img src="http://www.army.mil/cmh-pg/daseal2.jpg" alt="Army Logo" width="151" height="150" >

To all who helped this get started and keep it running, thank you!

Special thanks to Null and Void for keeping these threads running on the weekends, Mo1 for the screamer, the AdminMods for their tolerance, mhking for the video links, Ragtime Cowgirl for her Exclusive Live Transcription Service™, Fledermaus for his 15 minutes of fame, and, of course, Belly Girl...

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[stlnative]

REF TO POST #290

Sorry I missed a number (#15) so here it is
Children in the Iraqi town of Basra, step on a portrait of Saddam Hussein (news - web sites) Tuesday April 8, 2003. (AP Photo/Toni Nicoletti/Daily Record, Pool)

and here is the working link to (picture #16)
(16) Local Iraqi men cheer as British troops from the Household Guards and the Royal Irish Regiment carry out patrols in Medina, near Basra in southern Iraq (news - web sites), April 8, 2003. British officials said a local 'Sheikh' would form the leadership in Basra province of Iraq, as residents no longer under the yoke of Iraqi President Saddam Hussein (news - web sites)'s loyalists complained of lawlessness and want. REUTERS/POOL/Bruce Adams - Daily Mail

[spectr17]

CNN now quoting US mil official,

Most Iraqi troops in Baghdad have given up.

What given up means???? Surrender? Left town?

[Fledermaus]

Syrians have been told we can do to them in one hour what we did to Iraq in 21 days.

[Slip18]

Thanks. He is a sweety.

[O Neill]

Marshall McLuhan....

Yep...did he NAIL it, or what! What insight!!

[Prince Charles]

You're right, the fog of war can make anything possible, but I guess what I'm saying is that if the journalists said there were no shots because Baghdad Bob and his henchmen were holding guns to their heads, then that has some bearing on the reporting going on.

P.S.: I'm about 50 posts behind... tried to trim my fingernail with a hammer earlier. ;-)

[nopardons]

That may have appeared in something called " ARAB NEWS "; however, it was written by a Libertarian white male,filled with hatred for America and contempt for EVERYONE else too.

A HUGE BARF ALERT should have appeared in the header and no one should take the drivel as gospel. Yes, it DOES contain a few grains of truth in it, but not enough to make anyone take it as factual.

[bootyist-monk]

I agree about our journalists, and pray for their safety. The main difference is the US doesn't use them as a way to avoid taking fire, and that is clearly what the Iraqi Information Ministry is doing by parking themselves at the Palestine.

I think you're on to something when this thing gets near the end (if we haven't almost reached it already). There is a good chance that the Army and Marines may still have to go in there and rescue the media before this thing is over.

[GOPyouth]

I totally agree with you about this being a legal shot. :) Sorry for the delay on getting back to you.

[algol]

If the press was saying there were no shots from the hotel, yet the tankers say they were taking significant fire, then someone is either incorrect or is shading the truth.

Those are the two possibilities, yep.

Two further points of information: I've heard from a number of different people who were watching/listening to a BagCam feed at the time that they heard nearby small arms fire before the tank fired. Further, the Iraqi Ministry of Information could be exerting a strong influence on the remaining journalists in the hotel -- who have all been heavily exposed to Baghdad Bob's reality distortion field anyway.

Given that, I'm more inclined to believe the tankers.

[null and void]

All the news that fits...

the agenda.

[pnz1]

Isn't there video of the incident?

[umbagi]

I worked in the media a long time. Journalists are taught that their right to report is sacrosanct...and that sometimes interferes with their common sense.

A distinction should be made between those journalists who chose to 'embed' with the military under Pentagon authority, and those who are 'wild cards' hanging out at the hotel. While I don't think they should be targets, Vince Brooks and Torie Clarke made an excellent point: they were TOLD that Baghdad was not safe.

I agree with all your points. I took 15 hours of journalism, put in a lot of time with a pad in my back pocket (print only), and then spent years dealing with them as an elected official. My daughter is a MassComm major.

I agree with Shep's point, too; I don't agree with his making it in that manner, after they've kept this story on the front page so long. Air's limited; other stories have suffered.

[reformed_democrat]

Chaos was the battle plan, not conventional warfare.

Any nation observing our military behavior throughout the Clinton era would be mislead into believing we really are that inept. Throw a little chaos at us, and we'll fold up like a cheap ladder.

Our greatest advantage is that we learn from our mistakes, unlike dictatorships that have no choice but to follow the Party's battle plan.

Communists and democrats approach war the same way -- plans carved in stone, and a propoganda campaign to deny mistakes were made.

I find it believable that Putin would underestimate us so badly. He's an old-line communist, and believes the Soviet Union still has a chance at world domination.

If he is involved on the wrong side, boy, did he screw up.

[Slip18]

If your sister lives near you, he's close by. He lives in Truckee, CA. Skiing anyone?

[Fledermaus]

I just had a thought (strange, I know)...wouldn't it be great to officially recognize the new Iraqi government on July 4, 2003?

[texasbluebell]

I'm pretty fond of this photo myself! A member of the U.S. Marine 15th Expeditionary Unit Fox Company 'Raiders.

[Prince Charles]

True, but I'm not arguing that it was the tankers who were shading the truth. I'm accusing the press who were at the hotel, who may or may not be free to report what they see.