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To: Ronzo; templar
Boy, was I off...it was two trillion when I was still in college... At this point in time, the national DEBT is valued at $6,460,848,478,613.52.

You do understand that the basis of the American dollar is taxpayer indebtness.

I.E. if we pay off the national debt, our currency ceases to exist.

43 posted on 04/08/2003 8:32:56 AM PDT by AdamSelene235 (Like all the jolly good fellows, I drink my whiskey clear....)
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To: AdamSelene235
That is not true. As deficits widen the dollar weakens.

Our currency's strength is the productiveness of the American economy.

If you want to know what the strength of the dollar is you merely have to determine what it will buy in America. That is the last valuation- what it will buy here.

Exchange rates have several components within them which can obscure the relative values of the currencies.
46 posted on 04/08/2003 9:26:03 AM PDT by justshutupandtakeit (Saddam's Democrat Guard will stage suicide attacks against Coalition forces)
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To: AdamSelene235
You do understand that the basis of the American dollar is taxpayer indebtness.

No, this is something I don't quite understand. Any help you can provide would be appreciated.

48 posted on 04/08/2003 10:05:52 AM PDT by Ronzo (BOYCOTT HOLLYWOOD!!!)
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To: AdamSelene235
A respected Dallas Morning News financial columnist did a study recently and concluded that the fedgov owes the Social Security system an astounding $ 25 TRILLION because of borrowings made from the surpluses to mask our true deficits amassed by out of control fedgov spending. If this is true there won't be enough paper and ink to print all that fiat currency that will be needed when the baby boomers retire in large numbers.
57 posted on 04/08/2003 1:45:26 PM PDT by american spirit
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To: AdamSelene235
I.E. if we pay off the national debt, our currency ceases to exist

Yeah. But if we don't pay it off the number of dollars available to pay it off has to keep increasing infinitely just to service the debt without collapsing the economy (taxing the people beyond their abiliby to have enough left to continue buying new stuff and causing new employment and growth). The private debt is a huge factor as well, but not as easily tracked or discussed (it originates as government debt anyway). Money (effectively wage) inflation allows us to pay off old debt with new debt that is worth less than that which was borrowed (It's like paying off ounces of borrowed gold with the same number of ounces, but ones that have been diluted with base metal). Unfortunately as the debt is paid by new money, the new amount is always larger than the old amount (to cover interest) and the debt keeps going up, making the dollar worth less and less and the taxes have to go higher and higher to cover it.

I have a series of stamps from the Weimar Republic and Third Reich. They reflect the danger of financing the public debt with new and unbacked money. The first in the series is a 2 mark stamp. The inflation hit full swing about the time these were printed and by the time they got from the printer to the post office they had been overstamped 2 million marks, and then a few got overstamped again for 5 million marks. The next issue was back to 1 mark and has a photograph of Adolph Hitler on its face. (actually, I think there may have been a few stamps issued in between , but I don't have them in my collection. The points still the same.)

Then, we could always start paying down the debt, thereby reducing the money supply. this would be deflation. This also sounds good (getting out of or reducing debt, both public and private) till the effect on existing debt payments are considered. Less debt means less money available to buy things (money becomes more valuable if the amount of things stays the same or increases). It also means less money to pay wages. We end up paying off our 250,000 dollar mortgage, for example, with dollars that are effectively worth much more than the 250,000 we originally borrowed (as in your wages have dropped from 8 thou a month to 2 thou but you still are obligated for the 2.5 thou mortgage payment). the result of this is collapsing real estate (also stock, autos etc. of course, but that's too much to consider at once) prices leaving people owing much more than the value of the house. This leads to bankruptcies, forclosures, etc. that reduce further the amount of money available and we have a decending spiral into a crash like the Great Depression.

Of course, the Fed is in charge of regulating this money supply so that neither scenario happens. As long as the Fed is headed by someone with the wisdom of Solomon and the power of God we have nothing to worry about and can just go along in the bliss of unconcern. OTOH,.... well I have no suggestions. But, then, I'm not an economist or banker: I'm sure they have these things well under control.

IMO, FWIW.

67 posted on 04/08/2003 5:51:34 PM PDT by templar
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