Sleeping US Marine accidentally killed by his own gun

Reuters | 4/03/03

[Shooter 2.5]

Here's how it could have happened.
The article says nothing about sleeping in a tent or sleeping bag. The Marine could have fallen asleep in a sitting position with the 249 between his legs. His legs could have started to stretch out and that puts the muzzle to the chest area. His hand could have slipped off of his knee to hit the trigger.

Pure conjecture and wild *ss guess.

[supercat]

So it's a lot more likely that an open-bolt weapon will discharge when kicked, than will a closed-bolt weapon. A cocked open-bolt weapon, with the safety on, is a lot less safe than a cocked closed-bolt weapon, with the safety on.

A Daisy 2003 semiautomatic air pistol fires from the open bolt, but it includes a "backup sear" so that if the bolt slams forward without the trigger being pulled the bolt will fall almost all the way forward but not far enough to actually fire (net effect being that the weapon will be decocked). Trying to make a machine gun like this would be impractical, since such a weapon would jam frequently if the user released the trigger at the wrong time. It would seem a simple matter, however, to engineer the safety so that if the weapon was on "safe" when the bolt fell forward it would catch on the safety with the firearm almost completely decocked. Restoring the weapon to usability would probably require wasting a round (pulling the bolt back would eject the current round and feed a new one) but since that would only be necessary in cases where the weapon had malfunctioned and would otherwise have accidentally discharged I wouldn't think that a problem.

[clilly54]

Humor is a self-preservation knee-jerk... this soldier's death is so meaningless, it hurts. He died in a stupid accident.

We've had enough to cry about. If we try and sneak in a laugh in the middle of the barrage of horrible images and words coming our way these days, oh well...

[thisiskubrick]

This is my rifle and this is my gun; this one's for killing and this one's for fun.

[al_c]

No, it really was tasteless. There is a time and place for humor ... this thread is not that time or place.

[goldstategop]

HOLD MUH RIFLE AWAY FROM MUH CHEST WHEN I SLEEP ALERT!

[wku man]

God bless this Marine, who died serving his nation and protecting us all back here.

That said, I suspect there's more to this story than is being told. By nature, I'm skeptical of almost everything I'm told, whether by A.N.S.W.E.R or by CENTCOM. I suspect many of the "hard landings" and "crashes due to mechanical failure" of our helicopters in Iraq and Afghanistan have more likely been caused by enemy fire. The story surrounding PFC Lynch's capture and wounds is also changing (the docs are now saying she was not shot or stabbed). The truth will eventually come out in these and other incidents, but it will probably take a while. We may indeed learn that everything we're being told now is the truth, but until then, I'll wait for more information.

That doesn't change the fact that every member of the Allied forces over there is a hero or heroine, and we owe them much.

Scouts Out! Cavalry Ho!

[SMEDLEYBUTLER]

Beside, it is not a gun in the military.

Squad Automatic Weapon (SAW), M249 Light Machine Gun

[Flying Circus]

I'm sorry but combat does not seem to me a place to find people committing suicide with their own weapon. Admittedly I've never been in the miliary, but it does seems to me that strength of will to live is often what decides whether soldiers live or die during combat and one reason why morale can be so important to the military. If you don't have a will to survive, then you can very easily put yourself into a situation where the other guy can kill you and without having to pull the trigger yourself.

More likely the kid was just so tired he dozed off not noticing his weapon was in the wrong position, and it discharged. I've not heard anything indicating that our troops morale was low, by all indications our guys are kicking major butt over there with relatively few losses. But they are tired and sleep comes whenever and where-ever they can get it.

[joesnuffy]

Well if you have never been in combat for a sustained period of time...you dont know Jack Shiite

You dont know fatigue until your adrenaline is pumping for a week straight 24-7 and you never get to sleep

sleep deprivation in combat does strange things..to a man....sometimes...very strange..(but thats another story)

On the other hand your loaded weapon needs to be close at hand...saving your life and the lives of your comrades is a matter of nano seconds reaction sometimes...

Accident happen...sure you can store your weapon a safe distance away..unloaded with the safety on with the mags or ammo locked up and assure yourself that these kinds of accidents wont happen

Instead you will just be killed a different way...

An accident...a tragid one albeit...but an accident nontheless...shiite happens....

Bombs fall on the wrong target people get lost in sandstorms people incorrectly identify themselves and get shot trucks roll over grenades go off mine fields go unmarked or incorrectly market..hot weapons fall and triggers get tripped and sometimes people get shot or shoot themselves...

Read the annual deer hunting stats...no one has grenades rockets and missles yet a few a year get accidently shot..

In my platoon in vietnam a freshly minted sniper accidently shot a newby soldier on his way back from setting out the nightly perimeter claymores and trip wires...
We got guys killed by short rounds
I knew of a guy who got highly intoxicated fell off a Mekong River pier in a downpour at midnight and drowned
One guy..a close friend...after going without sleep for four days..accidently shot the CO in the leg with a ricochet tracer round..

[Liberal Classic]

Good post. I thought there was a way you could feed the first link of a belt in with the bolt forward and the tray closed, so all you had to do was pull the charging handle back to begin firing. Then again, I wasn't a gunner.

This was a tragic accident. No suicide. Vaya con Dios, Marine.