Family that lost 11 had been seeking refuge

Chicago Tribune ^ | 04/02/03 | Meg Laughlin

[dark_lord]

Language gap put them in peril at U.S. checkpoint

By Meg Laughlin Knight Ridder/Tribune news Published April 2, 2003

NEAR NAJAF, Iraq -- An Iraqi family that lost 11 members when U.S. soldiers opened fire as their vehicle approached a checkpoint was fleeing toward U.S. lines because they thought a leaflet dropped by American helicopters told them to "be safe," and that meant leaving their village, a survivor of the incident said Tuesday.

Bakhat Hassan--who lost his daughters, ages 2 and 5, his son, 3, his parents, two older brothers, their wives and two nieces, ages 12 and 15, in the incident Monday--said American soldiers at an earlier checkpoint had waved them through as they drove away from their village.

As they approached another checkpoint 25 miles south of Karbala, they waved again at the American soldiers.

"We were thinking these Americans want us to be safe," Hassan said through an Army translator at a Mobile Army Surgical Hospital near Najaf.

The soldiers didn't wave back. They fired.

"I saw the heads of my two little girls come off," Hassan's wife, Lamea, 36, recalled numbly. She repeated in a flat, even voice: "My girls--I watched their heads come off their bodies. My son is dead."

U.S. officials initially gave the death toll as seven and reporters at the scene placed it at 10. But Hassan's father died at the Army hospital later.

[...excerpted...]

Hassan's father, in his 60s, wore his best clothes for the trip through the American lines: a pinstriped suit, "to look American," Hassan said.

"A miscommunication with civilians," said a report written Monday night by the Army, which plans to investigate.

[...excerpted...]

The Shiite family of 17 was packed in its 1974 Land Rover, so crowded that Bakhat, 35, was outside on the rear bumper hanging on to the back door.

The others were piled on one another's laps in three sets of seats. They were fleeing their farm town southeast of Karbala, where U.S. attack helicopters had fired missiles and rockets the day before.

Helicopters also had dropped leaflets on the town: a drawing of a family sitting at a table eating and smiling with a message written in Arabic.

Sgt. Stephen Furbush, an Army intelligence analyst, said the message read: "To be safe, stay put."

But Hassan said he and his father thought it just said, "Be safe." To them, that meant getting away from the helicopters firing rockets.

[...excerpted...]

[VMI70]

Let's think about this for a moment.
Reverse the roles. You really don't know what Iraqis are like, leaflets notwithstanding. You and your extended family are in a car approaching an one of their checkpoints. They start yelling, firing their rifles in the air, then at your vehicle, then at you.
I don't know about you, but any normal person would be stupid not to do anything they could to get away from that situation.

[monday]

"But that would be a strange thing for a cleric to lie about.:

Not if he was a Shiite cleric who hated Saddam Hussien.

This is typical of what happens when people jump to conclusions based on hearsay evidence. I hate to say it but Fox seems to be making many mistakes in its reporting.

[monday]

"This is a different event than the 'women and children' checkpoint."

Same event.

"U.S. officials initially gave the death toll as seven and reporters at the scene placed it at 10. But Hassan's father died at the Army hospital later. "

This is a first person account from the victim who was there, the other account was from a muslim cleric and hearsay.

If the victim is to be believed then the cleric had an Anti Saddam Hussien agenda.

[monday]

1 spark posts"I saw a military guy on FOX (i'm pretty sure it was FOX) say that warning shots were fired (in the air?)and the vehicle did not stop. Then shots were fired into the engine to get it to stop, but it kept moving forward. At that point, they shot into the vehicle."

From the Washington Post yesterday.
"NEAR KARBALA, Iraq, March 31 -- As an unidentified four-wheel-drive vehicle came barreling toward an intersection held by troops of the Army's 3rd Infantry Division, Capt. Ronny Johnson grew increasingly alarmed. From his position at the intersection, he was heard radioing to one of his forward platoons of M2 Bradley Fighting Vehicles to alert it to what he described as a potential threat.

"Fire a warning shot," he ordered as the vehicle kept coming. Then, with increasing urgency, he told the platoon to shoot a 7.62mm machine-gun round into its radiator. "Stop [messing] around!" Johnson yelled into the company radio network when he still saw no action being taken. Finally, he shouted at the top of his voice, "Stop him, Red 1, stop him!"

That order was immediately followed by the loud reports of 25mm cannon fire from one or more of the platoon's Bradleys. About half a dozen shots were heard in all.

"Cease fire!" Johnson yelled over the radio. Then, as he peered into his binoculars from the intersection on Highway 9, he roared at the platoon leader, "You just [expletive] killed a family because you didn't fire a warning shot soon enough!"

It was just an accident. Mistakes happen, war is dangerous.

You will notice that the vehicle was fired on with 25 mm cannon. This would explain why the childrens heads were blown off.

Of the 17 family members 11 died. I am surprised six managed to survive.

a link to the Washington Post thread
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/882086/posts

[VMI70]

"Could be the cleric was lying."

Lying is normal there. They all lie.

"Truth are lies; lies are truth" or something like that.

[Minty]

Things like that happen. Bad that it had to be like that. I assumed they give the warning shots. Even so there will cases that willprove a mess. While in combat trying to survive people make mistakes. Now the republican guard is fighting from a mosque. If our troops defend themselves, then the only thing we will hear, is that they destroyed a holy site. How many will have to die? How many families will have to lose a loved one following that order? I say the lives of our troops comes first. I understand why they need to issue that order, the importance in addressing the muslims at large and wining them to reason. I just hope that when people see things like that they will also remember the other instances in which restraint has cost us lives. I doubt any soldier is happy to see that he/she have killed a family.

I can not blame our troops for that.

[Blueflag]

Sorry. Don't believe you.

VAN was reported vehicle in women children incident in reports I read.

Toyota Land Cruiser (or similar) was in the other rpoert.

Too many reported details differ for this to be the same report.

Everyone in this story has an agenda. Get over it.

Eventually the final facts will come out. For now, I don;t agree with you.

[Pagey]

Language gap put them in peril at U.S. checkpoint

Not to be rude, but this country is at war and this can be chalked up to 'collateral damage'.These types of actions are going to continue to occur no matter what.THey didn't slow down for gosh sake. Remember, we didn't start this war, but we will wipe them up over there by the time we're through.