WHAT IS THE CAUSE OF SARS? ONE VIRUS, TWO VIRUSES WORKING IN CONCERT, OR A DETERMINANT UNKNOWN

PRO MED - WHO ^ | 03-25-03

[Mother Abigail]

Q. The question about the 2 viruses having been, or 2 families of viruses having been associated with this disease or with this outbreak. You said it was not normal, if I'm not mistaken. Could you give us an idea of whether or not it's possible for a single disease to be caused by 2 viruses or is it more likely that at least one of the samples might not be related to SARS?

A. Dr Klaus Stohr: Speaking as a scientist, we are looking at a very interesting and a fascinating situation. Looking from the point of infectious disease control, we are a bit puzzled because we are not only dealing apparently with one pathogen but with 2.

The reason why we believe that both pathogens should be given equal attention is that there is consistent finding of both pathogens in individual patients or of either of the pathogens in other patients.

What we are seeing actually are 3 hypotheses.

The first hypothesis is that one of the viruses, for instance the corona virus, causes the disease, and that might be a new corona virus.

The second hypothesis is that the paramyxoviruses cause the disease and if that was the case, it's certainly also a new paramyxovirus.

The third hypothesis, very obviously, is that these 2 pathogens have to come together to cause this very severe outbreak. One of the viruses, for instance the coronavirus, is known to live in immune cells, cells which are important for defense against infection. So what one could hypothesize is that this coronavirus destroys or at least diminishes the immunity in the patient so that the second virus has practically an open door to go in and to sicken the patient beyond what this virus would be able to do normally.

Dr David Heymann: Let me just add to that: there could be a fourth hypothesis. It is possible that both are common viruses: one found in all the patients, even though it's not causing disease, and the other will be the disease-causing agent, so they could both be found but not be related in any way, just there by chance. So it's a very complicated issue that's being sorted out.

[Domestic Church]

"...but not for vertebrate viruses with the exception of hepatitis B virus and delta virus. "

1) What are the odds of a satellite nucleic acid or virus developing a trigger mechanism on man...naturally.


2) Might such a satellite tie into the west nile virus?

[Mother Abigail]

Latin acutus, past participle of acuere to sharpen, from acus needle; akin to Latin acer sharp

Characterized by sharpness or severity - acute pain

Ending in a sharp point

[grimalkin]

Thanks for the update.

[Mother Abigail]

To be honest we do not know.

Two labs have found different bugs in the lungs of victims

Problem is these are both variations of very common viruses found in most people.

Are these findings pointing to the real cause of SARS, or are they just Artifacts?

No one is sure

[maestro]

Thanks,.....
From another thread:
To: JohnHuang2
?...Growing Children...?
SCHOOL'S OUT
The Singapore government went further on Wednesday evening. It said it would halt classes for the city state's 500,000 children to try to alleviate parent concern, despite saying in a statement there were no medical reasons to close schools.
Children put 'things' in their mouth......checking crayons,...paste,...erasers,...candy.....??....and take them/it 'home'.
Todlers are diapered,......check the diapers too.
BIO-SCIENCE could be checking 'dormant' genes/DNA of growing children....testicle/seed growth,...teeth,...hair,...ear/eye diseases (other finger areas).
(Powered Milk Formula,...and,...Pet Food)

?....do sweat glands develope by degrees...ie. are there 'bio-keys' involved?

[aristeides]

Do you recall how long it was before they made the breakthrough of finding the HIV virus in early AIDS patients?

My recollection is that that took about a year.

[TheBigB]

Gosh, as a scientist by training, I -do- know what I'm talking about. The media are jumping on this because it's new and yes, it's spreading. Let me also quote from the CDC itself:

Available data indicate that transmission seems to require direct or close contact. Cases have occurred among health care workers caring for ill patients and close family contacts. CDC is taking locating information from travelers who are on flights with people suspected of having SARS. CDC, with the help of state and local health authorities, is attempting to follow up on these travelers for 7 days to make sure no one develops symptoms consistent with SARS. So far, no cases of SARS have been reported in these travelers.

Remember what we all went through in the first stage of AIDS fear? "Don't sit on a public toilet seat" "Don't drink after someone who has it" "ANYONE CAN GET IT!!" I'm willing to bet that in about two weeks, cases will decrease dramatically, deaths will stabilize, and the media attention will drop correspondingly.

[aristeides]

I think the 1918-19 Spanish flu had a death rate something like this 3%. It killed more people than World War One.

[Mother Abigail]

Yes, you said it very well, but the two viruses might be found in anyone - say death by gunshot (this is pure speculation on my part and has yet to be proven)

It took years in the case of AIDS

[aristeides]

You seem not to have noticed this story: Officials probe ease of pneumonia's spread.

[aristeides]

Number of cases seems to be doubling every three or four days.

[TheBigB]

Saw it. Read it.

"We need to make sure if there are other cases in schools, they aren't cases that are randomly occurring but are cases which sat next to students who are sick," said Dr. David Heymann of the World Health Organization in Geneva. "The same goes for airplanes. We would want to make sure that it was people sitting next to that person and not the ventilation system in the airplane that was spreading the disease."

When everyone in a given plane comes down with the disease from one passenger, or every child in a school gets it from one, then I'll worry. Until then, I will maintain that at least 90% of this whole story is based on the fact that the media need something to scare us with.

[maestro]

I think the 1918-19 Spanish flu had a death rate something like this 3%. It killed more people than World War One.

Was not it caused by animal dung particles...
(Mixed and roasted w/anthrax spore history?)

[Mother Abigail]

I think that the data might support a 4% mortality rate at this point. With modern facilities using heroic methods. We are running out of respirators in HK

Look for that number to rise

I thought you described the current situation very well

[TheBigB]

PS, I'm not trying to flame or anything.

[CathyRyan]

The plea follows the detection of 9 atypical pneumonia cases among members of a Beijing tour organized by a Hong Kong travel agent.

The tour comprised 35 tour members and a staff member of the travel agent. They left for Beijing in flight CA 112 on 15 Mar 2003 and returned to Hong Kong in flight CA 115 on 19 Mar 2003.

Investigation revealed that a couple who joined the tour, both aged 44, had developed symptoms during their stay in Beijing on 18 Mar 2003. They were admitted to Tuen Mun Hospital on the evening of 22 Mar 2003 and are now in stable condition.

On receiving the notification on 23 Mar 2003, DH immediately contacted other members of the tour. Among them 3, one man and 2 women aged between 27 and 50, were also confirmed to have developed atypical pneumonia symptoms. They were admitted to Tuen Mun Hospital and Pamela Youde Nethersole Eastern Hospital for treatment. They are in stable condition.

6 other members of the tour who had been reported to have coughs, 3 men and 3 women aged between 32 and 61, were admitted to hospitals for close surveillance earlier. Four of them, comprising 2 men and 2 women aged between 32 and 51, were confirmed today to have infected with atypical pneumonia. They are receiving treatment in Queen Elizabeth Hospital. The fifth person, a 61-year-old man, is still under observation in Tuen Mun Hospital. The sixth person, a 48-year-old woman, was discharged yesterday.

It is suspected that the couple contracted the disease from a passenger, a man aged 73, who sat close to them on their way to Beijing. The man was feeling unwell after visiting his brother in Ward 8A of Prince of Wales Hospital earlier this month.

DH has informed the Airport Authority, the Civil Aviation Department and the airline concerned. Advice was also given to the airline concerned to disinfect the airplanes.

DH is tracing the crew members and passengers who had taken these two flights, for surveillance purposes.

http://www.promedmail.org/pls/askus/f?p=2400:1001:181253007398646712::NO::F2400_P1001_BACK_PAGE,F2400_P1001_PUB_MAIL_ID:1000,21079

[Mother Abigail]

You are quite welcome

[Doctor Stochastic]

A doctor telling a woman that she has acute appendicitis isn't nessarily a compliment or a come-on.

[JasonC]

By far the most likely answer. They just haven't found it yet.

[maestro]

Another post today...
China Grants Historic Air Rights (Singapore Airlines to stop in China en route to Chicago)
^ Posted by LurkedLongEnough
On 03/26/2003 8:55 AM PST
Airwise Top Stories ^ | Mar 25, 2003 | Staff
Singapore Airlines cargo arm has made a small piece of aviation history by winning permission to pick up freight and passengers on mainland China during flights to the US. According to a report in the China Daily newspaper, fifth freedom rights have been granted to SIA Cargo by the country's civil aviation authority. It is the first foreign carrier to be handed the concession. The airline will be able to exercise its new rights from May 22 on its route between Singapore and Chicago which involves two stops in China, at Xiamen and Nanjing. The newspaper says that China's decision........