[Tailback]

M8 is/was not an infantry carrier -it's a light armored gun platform. Apples and oranges. Stryker is vastly superior to M8 when it comes to transporting infantry.

When I brought up the M8 I meant to compare it to the 105mm armed Stryker which cannot shoot sideways (too much recoil, it will tip over) and cannot fit in a C130 at all. I'm not sure whether the 105 Stryker can carry troops either. It also weighs over 45,000 lbs while the M8 in it's air droppable setup weighs 39,000 pounds. With the level 2 upgrade armor the Stryker only weighs 44,000 pounds. Right now though the MGS (105 armed Stryker) is being redesigned because it stinks so bad.

February 28, 2002 (U) MOBILE GUN SYSTEM (MGS) WEIGHT REDUCTION PLAN (U). As part of our Risk Management program, the Project Manager Brigade Combat Team (PM BCT) and the Interim Armored Vehicle (IAV) Joint Venture (JV) contractor have initiated a plan to reduce the weight of the Mobile Gun System (MGS). Currently the combat weight of the MGS is 45,165 lbs. At this weight, the user is required to remove 7,165 pounds of equipment from the MGS prior to C-130 transport. At the PM's joint quarterly Program Review, the JV committed to developing and implementing a plan to reduce the vehicle weight through redesign and manufacturing techniques. This reduction of vehicle weight will reduce the impact to the MGS Soldier. The goal of this effort is to reduce the combat weight of the MGS to 43,700 pounds in development (July 2002) and 40,250 pounds in production (June 2003). Both these weights will allow the vehicle to meets its transportability weigh requirement, the latter greatly reducing the need to remove Soldier items. The funding required to support this weight reduction effort is being reviewed by the PM's vehicle Integrated Product Team (IPT) and PM BCT. PM BCT has made initial coordination with the Army Staff and OSD on funding requirements. Impact to the Army: Will require movement of FY03 IAV WTCV funding to RDTE during Congressional marking period. COL David Ogg/PM BCT/(810) 753-2000 Oggd@tacom.army.mil APPROVED BY: LTG John Caldwell

So the airborne and IBCT's are still without heavy direct fire support when a vehicle that was already approved by DOD and merely months away from full-scale production which is better suited to the mission is not fielded. Now a quote from Tom Clancy

"Unfortunately, the need to support the expensive peacekeeping operations in places like Bosnia, Haiti, and Rwanda caused the top leadership of the Army to cancel the AGS program, and reprogram the funds. Frankly, given the small size of the AGS program, this was a bad decision. Unfortunately, without any replacement for the M551, the same Army leaders moved from bad decision-making to outright stupidity when they decided to stand down the 3/73 Armored, thus denying the 82nd even the services of 66 thirty-year-old light tanks."

The M113 with a turret will still be shorter than a Stryker without a turret. What are you, some retired Officer working for the company making the Stryker?

[Rain-maker]

Let's refresh your memory about sedition.

 

SEC. 2. That if any person shall write, print, utter. Or publish, or shall cause or procure to be written, printed, uttered or published, or shall knowingly and willingly assist or aid in writing, printing, uttering or publishing any false, scandalous and malicious writing or writings against the government of the United States, or either house of the Congress of the United States, or the President of the United States, with intent to defame the said government, or either house of the said Congress, or the said President, or to bring them. or either of them, into contempt or disrepute; or to excite against them, or either or any of them, the hatred of the good people of the United States, or to excite any unlawful combinations therein, for opposing or resisting any law of the United States, or any act of the President of the United States, done in pursuance of any such law, or of the powers in him vested by the constitution of the United States, or to resist, oppose, or defeat any such law or act, or to aid, encourage or abet any hostile designs of any foreign nation against the United States, their people or government, then such person, being thereof convicted before any court of the United States having jurisdiction thereof, shall be punished by a fine not exceeding two thousand dollars, and by imprisonment not exceeding two years.

http://www.ku.edu/carrie/docs/texts/sedact.htm

 

[rmlew]

Why don't we just update the M8?