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"by someone convicted a number of times of defrauding farmers . . . "

The only thing he was ever convicted of was of casting out an evil spirit. The judge then noted there was no law against it and released him.

"telling farmers he had a secret map found on each of the farmer's property . . ."

Didn't happen.

"Then there's the fun story from the father of my best man at my wedding . . ."

A 4th or 5th hand story with no confirmation. Come on, if you want to attack someone's religion with rumours and hearsay, take it somewhere else.

The Palmyra sp? New York court records are evidently quite clear on what--3 or 4 different convictions for defrauding farmers?

Walter Martin--I think also a descendant of B Young or J Smith, I forget which--researched such things exhaustively. His research skills and integrity stand as models.

Another famous couple who left the church having had to fact far tooooo much uncomfortable truth to any more pretend there was anything valid to believe also has done extensive research on such things. Wish I could think of their names. Guess I'll have to go to Google when I have the time.

I don't think B Young NOR J Smith have ANY grounds to stand on in terms of integrity. Their abuse of a long list of people is just far too extensive.

I standy by the walking on water story. It was not 5th hand. I talked to the son of the man who saw it happen.

Just the changes in the Book of Mormon alone--the Book they used to deny was ever changed--but went through AT LEAST 5 revisions--just those changes alone are enough to call foul about.