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Total bunk. They lost control of their country to the people. Now the gangsters are in charge, and that will pass with time. Capitalismis the natural human condition.
4 posted on 01/19/2003 5:27:54 PM PST by stubernx98
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To: stubernx98
Are you saying that Putin is a gangster?
11 posted on 01/19/2003 5:58:25 PM PST by TheMilkMan
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To: stubernx98
"Capitalism is the natural human condition."

. . .yes and Capitalism requires moral human beings to sustain it. . .communism destroys the moral. A successful Capitalism cannot happen overnight in a country whose moral base has been so undermined.

12 posted on 01/19/2003 6:19:51 PM PST by cricket
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To: stubernx98
II suggest you read some of Lenin’s works. Communists and gangsters are one and the same during his days, the days throughout the Soviet Union, and why should it be considered anything less in the post days as nothing has changed with the exceptions of a few boundaries and names the rest of the system still remains intact(military, production, Organ departments [in charge of security apparatus]? They used the drug trade to gain sources of finance during the cold war days through the use of Castro's Cuba (1982 Cuban General caught smuggling drugs into the U.S. and known from the defector Major-General Jan Senja) as well using the Czech's as to distance themselves incase their operations where exposed. And they were, but alas the West like in so many other things, ignores the brutality of dangerous regimes so we can just get along and think that we can just buy our way to peace. That is the lemming left effect. Regan helped to slow it down, but he could not stop it. If you disagree with that, just look at 8 years of the traitor Clinton and company along with his appeasement toward Moscow’s proliferation of NBC to various countries, aid to help the Chinese in tech and weapons along with covering up their aggression in the Spratly's(Phillippines), helping cover up its role in helping Pakistan nuclear capabilities(so China has a proxy to fight India since it would be devastating to take them on directly.)

Now look at the Chinese and the Russians, they have signed the Good Neighborly and Friendship Treaty on 7-16-01. The same treaty that the two signed on 5 year increments prior to the Sino-Soviet split in the early 60's. It also has a provision in it that requires Moscow to come to the aid of China in the event that America interferes with China's take over of Taiwan should it become a military conflict. The aid can include supplies, logistics, military aid in the region, or quite possibly use its 20,000 to 40,000 nuclear warheads that have never been disabled and to some extent been upgrade with foreign aid meant to dismantle them in the first place. Assuming the worst case wouldn't happen, then that would but the Administration into a bind. On one hand what do they do, tell Russia take a hike and risk all out war or do they try the diplomatic approach which will only give the communist in China a green light to take Taiwan and quite possible start other campaign in the Pacific region to insure its control of all water way activity(trade)for example the Straights of Malacca as pointed out by Yossef Bodansky(www.freeman.org/m_online/bodansky/beijing.htm)

If Russia is only a gangster, then why arm, supply, give tech, send NBC scientists, to Iraq, Iran, Syria, Egypt, Pakistan, China? Why continue to prop up dictatorships and communists, which they clearly do? Why still conduct the drug trade? For money only?? No, that is not the answer since money is only the means to an end. So what is that end? Peace? Or is it war(POWER) just as it has always been since the communist have gotten a strangle hold on countries. Total control. Then there is the possibility for a country like China to turn around on Russia and destroy her. No, the Russians are all to aware of their history with China, they just have a common enemy that stands in their way. That will eventually be her undoing when China is strong enough.

Also an important aspect to Capitalism is being overlooked, it isn't an ideology like a moral belief system. It is a barter and trade system that enriches those engaged in such activity. For a society to exist, every system must have a form of it. One Capitalist system can have a moral system imbedded into it just like ours but that seems to have really failed over the last decade due to the forecast of unending good times. Collective hypnosis if you will. Then there is another system that exists in a totalitarian system. It is called the black market. If that totalitarian system is really smart or just cut throat, it will either destroy it(thus the people starve and could revolt in mass and to enough extent to over throw the totalitarian, or it can use it as a means of controlling the people, gaining extra capital since any true prosperity is limited by government mandate and efficiency. If you look further into Russian history you will find a culture of thieves during the day of the Tzars. Lenin also took note of it, used their tactics to bypass the Tzars rule of law, and eventually incorporated it into his vision of the World Revolution. After all one needs a way to finance a war on civilization, why not let the civilization that you are fighting against finance its own demise? Look at Lenin’s NEP(New Economic Program) during the 20's. He proclaimed communism is dead that it cannot work, the West being the useful idiots that they are gave them money, infrastructure, people(by which many never returned especially U.S. workers with only a few exceptions) to help them become a democracy. But as we all know communism never went away, it just gave birth to Stalinism and Stalin killed 40 million people or so. He even initiated two or three liberalization attempts to get the west to relax and give him aid. One was in the mid 30's and the second was when Hitler attacked Stalin(good old Uncle Jo). He also gave us Red China and a death of at least 100 million in that country to the present since the West wasn’t up to the fight. After Stalin's passing the Soviet Union was a wreak. The West could easily have taken it out in the late 40's to early 50's though that would have meant some pain. Instead the West just infused them with even more money and aid. It is a repeating cycle that communist have used over and over again. After all, wouldn't you if West never caught on. Then if it did, you just change our tactics and strategy. It is a war of attrition, death by a thousand cuts. It is slow and it is determined to destroy. The West is now facing the consequences of its inactions and its aiding of the enemy.

Castro(Cuba), Chavez(Venezuela), Lula(Brazil more recent and talk of renewing its nuke program), Equador, Lybia as a supporter, are now a communist force that is growing in power and in appetite and have a powerful ally in China. Currently Argentina is being worked on by this force(it is an economic basket case and only getting worse, the people want the good life and are willing to do anything to get it back which is usually how communist slip in the back door, the people elect them which is another old communist tactic). The communist group called FARC in Columbia is winning its war on the pro western government here(also supported by Chavez and Castro). Mexico has always been corrupt and that makes it vulnerable to future actions by the communists. Then we have Islamic terrorist training in these various areas where communist have control. Normally one would ask questions and say something isn’t right here, but after all this is the West which is afflicted with delusion and Liberalism.
30 posted on 01/19/2003 8:33:57 PM PST by DarkWaters
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To: stubernx98
Interesting how those so called "gangsters" seem to behave in manner similar to the KGB and Lenin's original late 1910s thugocracy. They do all they can to undermine the West. And is it not a bit strange that a man who bore witness to and participated in the true crimes of the Stasi is now in command of Russia / USSR2?
46 posted on 01/23/2003 1:00:47 PM PST by GOP_1900AD (Un-PC even to "Conservatives!" - Right makes right)
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To: stubernx98
Total bunk. They lost control of their country to the people. Now the gangsters are in charge, and that will pass with time. Capitalismis the natural human condition.

It's not convincing to try to debunk something by adding your own superstitions to it.

70 posted on 01/24/2003 7:06:59 AM PST by JudgemAll
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