White House promises 'smoking gun intelligence'

The Daily Telegraph ^ | January 16, 2003 | Toby Harnden

[The Great Satan]

Oh, please. Don't start with the 35As crap. You are so full of it. By the way, did you ever track down those conspirators who were playing with your head on your stock tipster board? I mean, the ones whose names were all derived from proteases?

[niman]

ROFLMAO! Weren't you saying that on anthrax_fans a year ago?

Did the anthrax_fans exist a year ago?

[The Great Satan]

Please, don't start with your BS again. We've been through all this, many moons ago. You tried to get personal information on people, you threatened them with lawsuits, then you took your marbles and ran away, like a good little paranoid schizophrenic. And now, you surface again, like a smelly turd that refuses to go down the toilet. What's up with that, Niman?

[niman]

I certainly have never said the attack was US sponsored.

Let me clarify. It was state sponsored in the sense that Ames was isolated and grown in the US and the US program provide sponsorship for developing the know how to weaponize the material. However, the state didn't sponsor (by giving orders) the one or two US scientists who did the mailings.

[The Great Satan]

However, the state didn't sponsor (by giving orders) the one or two US scientists who did the mailings.

So you foreswear and eschew the full Kristoff? Once and for all, Steve Hatfill did not receive anthrax from his CIA controls at a secret Cipro party in a safe house in Virginia, contrary to the absurd suggestion of Nicolas Kristoff in the New York Times. Correct?

Where's the grand jury, Henry?

[niman]

We've been through all this, many moons ago.

Mort, It looks like most on this board are lacking the science, and I assumed that you could help them out with your expertise.

As far as knowing your identity, it really wasn't that hard, so you need not worry about that. You are who you are and that part is fairly well known.

[niman]

contrary to the absurd suggestion of Nicolas Kristoff in the New York Times. Correct?

As I said, the Morton D Ballard / Louis Mason theory is becoming increasingly popular. Coupled with Alfred Hitchcock's "Rope" it looks to be an "award winner", which I think you understand.

[The Great Satan]

Mort, It looks like most on this board are lacking the science, and I assumed that you could help them out with your expertise.

Science? The science of "35 As"? ROFL! Nobody's going to be fooled by your BS diarrhea of pseudo-scientific jargon this time around, niman. It's too late for a snow job. Nobody's buying it. Try posting a picture of yourself wearing a white coat. Too bad about losing that tenure-track position by the way. What was the problem? Too much BS?

BTW, where's the grand jury, Henry?

[Mitchell]

1. The anthrax did not come from the USA.

Even Level 1 is tricky here. Ames strain anthrax did come from the U.S.A., of course. It was isolated from a dead cow in Texas, now the second most famous cow in history (the first being Mrs. O'Leary's cow which did not start the Great Chicago Fire).

Presumably when people say that the anthrax did not come from the U.S.A, they mean that a sample was brought from the U.S.A. to another country, where it was cultured and weaponized; also that it was delivered by foreign agents in support of some foreign military or terrorist purpose.

[fso301]

I just hope no intelligence assets lose their life over the disclosures or that any very secret technology is compromised.

[niman]

Too bad about losing that tenure-track position by the way

Vic, Speaking of positions, how do you like working in NJ? Looks to be a much easier commute.

[niman]

Presumably when people say that the anthrax did not come from the U.S.A, they mean that a sample was brought from the U.S.A. to another country, where it was cultured and weaponized; also that it was delivered by foreign agents in support of some foreign military or terrorist purpose.

Mitchell, You have been listing to Vic too much. Can you name ONE citation for Ames with 35 A's outside of the US that matches the attack Ames? I susspect Vic will not want to discuss this from a science point of view, because there is NO DATA.

How about from a media point of view. Have you read one citation of Ames with 35 A's outside of the US? I didn't think so.

[The Great Satan]

What was the problem? Just that your science was no good, or was it your paranoid-schizophrenic tendencies, or you proclivity for threatening people with lawsuits?

[Allan]

1. The anthrax did not come from the USA.

I should have been more precise.
Rephrase that:

1. The spores did not come from the USA.

[Mitchell]

I didn't say whether I believed that it came from outside the U.S.A., or in what sense it might have come from outside the U.S.A. I was merely pointing out that even asking what it means to come from outside the U.S.A. was more complicated than one might realize.

And, no, TGS has not convinced everyone of his theory. My mind is open until I see some actual evidence.

[niman]

for threatening people with lawsuits?

Vic, I would think that a lawsuit would be the least of your worries. Let's focus on some science and put some of that UPenn PhD training to work.

Why is it that no one has come up with ONE example of Ames with 35 A's outside of the US?

[The Great Satan]

Don't start with the BS henry. Just tell us about the tenure thing. That must have been quite a blow. Still, I think Pitt is well rid of you. Even in a low status department like Epidemiology, you want people who are a little bit more than bullsh***ers, correct?

[niman]

I was merely pointing out that even asking what it means to come from outside the U.S.A. was more complicated than one might realize.

Mitchell, Good point. By definition all Ames attack anthrax originated from the US because the bacteria was isolated from a cow that died in Texas in 1980. In fact I know of only two natural isolates of Ames, and both came from Texas (not withstanding the Ames-like nonsense posted about the accidental releas in the former Soviet Union in 1979).

[niman]

TGS has not convinced everyone of his theory. My mind is open until I see some actual evidence.

Mitchell, Glad to hear that. I was worried that Vic had converted everyone on the anthrax_fans board in my absence. I take it that Vic hasn't presented any evidence there either.

[The Great Satan]

Where's the grand jury, henry?