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Chip Production Moving to China
Insight ^ | Dec. 31, 2002 | Christopher Whalen

Posted on 01/04/2003 5:28:38 PM PST by Tailgunner Joe

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1 posted on 01/04/2003 5:28:38 PM PST by Tailgunner Joe
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To: Tailgunner Joe
Taiwanese manufacturers are struggling to keep up with the likes of IBM and Intel

While IBM is currently and always has been the leader, TSMC and UMC in Taiwan are toe to toe with AMD and Intel and don't show any sign of falling by the wayside

2 posted on 01/04/2003 5:38:50 PM PST by ContentiousObjector
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To: ContentiousObjector
"TSMC and UMC in Taiwan are toe to toe with AMD and Intel and don't show any sign of falling by the wayside"

I have never heard of a computer "Powered by TSMC". Intel and AMD develop CPU's (and hundreds of other IC's). Are these places only fabs? The major bucks are in innovation, not rote production.

3 posted on 01/04/2003 5:52:12 PM PST by lawdude
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To: lawdude
there are lots of companies in Asia who manufacture processors, although there is little incentive to get into the x86 business when there are two giants beating the shit out of each other.

The manufacturing side is just as important as what is being manufactured, how practical would a Pentium 4 die the size of a basketball court be? (for anything other than heating)

4 posted on 01/04/2003 5:59:14 PM PST by ContentiousObjector
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To: Tailgunner Joe
It is my contention that R&D will sooner or later, likely sooner, follow production abroad. When that happens the US will cease to be the driving force behind technological advances. Thus others will begin to drive certain industries that have been very important to our national goals.

Technology was going to be the be-all end-all to replace manufacturing. Some of us said that was falicy. Now we're seeing one of the major reasons why. As tech manufacturing and R&D move offshore, the US will lose it's tech advantages. As this takes place the US will lose some of the luster behind it's dollar, and investment in the United States.

China is already a growing threat to investment in the United States.

I was watching FoxNews the other day. (It was either Fox or CNBC.) It was reported that European investment in the United States fell from $54 billion in 2001, to $550 million in 2002. It was also reported that Asian investment in the United States climbed during the same period. But the gains were much less than the losses from Europe. The gains were something like $32 Billion vs $10 billion the year before.

The overall net loss of foreign investment from these to sectors was about $30 billion.

I believe the time frame was 2001 vs 2002. The actual time frame may be somewhat different, not much.

The handwriting is on the wall. We are going to have one hell of a time paying down our budget deficits if we lose foreign investment. It appears we are already headed well down that road. Globalists can pat themselves on the back for this turn of events.

5 posted on 01/04/2003 5:59:57 PM PST by DoughtyOne
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To: Thud
ping
6 posted on 01/04/2003 6:14:32 PM PST by Dark Wing
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To: DoughtyOne
Yep, it's called "killing the goose that laid the golden eggs". The US is slipping beneath the waves.
7 posted on 01/04/2003 6:38:52 PM PST by The Duke
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To: DoughtyOne
Solutions, other than put up trade barriers that will turn us into a French-style economy?
8 posted on 01/04/2003 6:54:29 PM PST by kaktuskid
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To: lawdude
I know that at least many AMD and Intel cpu's are not made in America. Some Intel cpu's are made in Malaysia.
9 posted on 01/04/2003 7:00:24 PM PST by Revel
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To: The Duke
This is what worries me:

The warning signals are there. They have been for a long time. If our leaders don't wake up and take immiediate action it will too late. China is already drawing away tens of billions of dollars in foreign investment. I'm not even sure if we could stop that process now that we've seeded and watered it.

One of the problems we now face, is that corporations at this point have an alternate decision to make. If the US tries to undo it's mistakes, they can opt to move their operations to China, abandoning the US. We set up that opportunity.

There's going to be hell to pay. One of the most prominant will be civil disorder, which our federal government recognizes and is trying to avoid at all cost as this nation becomes unstable. This may sound alarmist, but not being able to service our massive debt plus ballooning government programs will wind up in caos. The same citizens that yelled the loudest about the globalist mistakes being made, will be the ones who'll pay the heaviest as the federal government flails around not knowing what the hell to do, to rectify their gross negligence, and needing to keep discent quiet at all cost.

Once in the driver's seat, the US will have no choice but to abdicate it's world status to the UN. The outcome will not look good. We'll see things implemented in this nation that we never thought possible, because we'll need foreign help to keep us afloat.

Those that implemented these failed policies will find some way to blame the worker class. Unions, the scorn of reasoned Conservatives, will fluorish as pressures to cut wages and benefits mount. This will see Marxist policies fluorish in our nation.

The dollar will tank as the printing presses smoke under increasing pressure. It's going to be grand.

Hint: Learn Chinese. They have Krushev's rope.

10 posted on 01/04/2003 7:04:08 PM PST by DoughtyOne
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To: kaktuskid
Prior to 1992, we didn't experience the trade deficits we do today. How is it that we became the preeminant nation on the planet prior to 1992? Shouldn't it have occurred after 1992? Your supposition regarding trade cannot be true, can it?
11 posted on 01/04/2003 7:11:32 PM PST by DoughtyOne
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To: DoughtyOne
It is my contention that R&D will sooner or later, likely sooner, follow production abroad.

It's already happening.

I have a friend (he has a PhD) who was just laid off from a commercial R&D company. It turns out that they are starting an R&D division in Red China.

I despise the corporate bastards who make these decisions. And I despise the politicians who allow this to happen through their treasonous policies.

It is NOT free trade.

12 posted on 01/04/2003 7:19:33 PM PST by Mulder
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To: DoughtyOne
SELLING CHINA THE ROPE
13 posted on 01/04/2003 7:24:25 PM PST by Tailgunner Joe
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To: Mulder
I hear you bud. It beats anything I've ever seen. Our political and corporate leaders are selling out this nation and it's ideals as fast as they can. We are becoming a hollow shell that cannot sustain it's own weight.

About all we can do these days, is position ourselves for the inevitable to come.

14 posted on 01/04/2003 7:27:57 PM PST by DoughtyOne
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To: Tailgunner Joe
Thanks for the link. The truly sad thing is, you and others are able to back up what I have been saying on a moment's notice. Sure it's nice to have the facts, but the facts themselves are downright scarey.

Bush is as willing to sell this nation out as any other corporate entity or former administration.

Now in full control, it's going to be a real eye opener what this guy decides to do over the next two years. I happen to believe many solid supporters are going to see the light as it becomes even too obvious for them to ignore any longer.

We shall see.

15 posted on 01/04/2003 7:32:47 PM PST by DoughtyOne
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To: DoughtyOne
Just wait and see if he wins in 2004. If he does he will not have to worry about reelection so watch out.
16 posted on 01/04/2003 7:34:15 PM PST by Karsus
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To: DoughtyOne
Our political and corporate leaders are selling out this nation and it's ideals as fast as they can.

Both parties, at the top anyway, are selling us out.

It's hard to imagine that only 20 years, Larry McDonald (anti-NWO) was going to run for President as a Democrat. Now that party has been taken over by gays, abortionists, illegal immigrants, illiterates, and outright traitors.

And only 20 years ago, President Reagan was talking about the "government being the problem" and "reawaking this industrial giant". The GOP has abandonded both those planks in favor of quasi-socialism and full blown globalism.

About all we can do these days, is position ourselves for the inevitable to come.

Those who pay attention realize that "it's coming".

17 posted on 01/04/2003 7:38:58 PM PST by Mulder
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To: Karsus
That is a valid thought, but then his party will want to win again. Now if you believe there actually are two parties, this may carry some weight. If you believe as I do that both parties have essentially become one new ReDem-Globalist party, then it really won't matter what party takes over in 2004, 08, 12, 16...

With the FTAA in the wings, I think it's clear that the witch's brew isn't owned by either party. Global One World Government is here. We are a part of it. It will in no way resemble anything our founding fathers had in mind for us.

18 posted on 01/04/2003 7:40:20 PM PST by DoughtyOne
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To: Mulder
I despise the corporate bastards who make these decisions. And I despise the politicians who allow this to happen through their treasonous policies.

Corporate management does not look beyond the next quarterly report. Why should they? The CEO at company X this year, may be at company Y next year. Management does not have a stake in the long-term future of their companies -- they want to get the stock price up this month so they can cash in their options.

The whole situation is unstable. Huge corporations are not overseen by anybody with a financial incentive to look after the long-term interests of the stock holders. The boards of directors to a large extent are rubber-stamps for management.

19 posted on 01/04/2003 7:40:57 PM PST by SauronOfMordor
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To: ContentiousObjector
"there are lots of companies in Asia who manufacture processors, although there is little incentive to get into the x86 business when there are two giants beating the shit out of each other."

Boy, I shloshed my share of wafers in buffered HF over the years. Look at the worth of Intel and AMD an Motorola (until recently), etc. The innovators make the bucks. The wafer processors pay 5.75/hour and don't truly stimulate the economy. Device designers and the like make the bucks.

I haven't kept up with the semicon business since I bailed out in '88. Who are the big-guns now?



20 posted on 01/04/2003 7:41:10 PM PST by lawdude
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