[Technogeeb]

The HHS has a long track record of using honest calculations to determine the poverty level

Irrelevant, since there is no mechanism in place to insure that future supposed honesty (and your assertion is a lie in any case. Robert Reich, Clinton's secretary of labor, has admitted that the administration didn't adjust the poverty level during the Clinton administration for fear that it would make the poverty rate would look worse. Check out the May 26, 2001 issue of the New York times for proof of his statement). Until Bensen used his regulatory power to ban several shotguns, the treasury department had a history of assuming 12 gauge shotguns were suitable for sporting purposes. All it took was one person willing to abuse that power, in the same way that it would only take one person to abuse the power granted under the "prebate" system to pervert the US economy into communism.

However, members of congress could start to correct their frauds by being honest like the HHS

That you are willing to trust an unelected bureaucracy with almost complete arbitrary power over the US tax system over the elected representatives of the people suggests that you are either irrational or are sympathetic to tyranny. And if you believe that the HHS is an "honest" agency then you have no clue of their history. Under the Constitution, most of their activities are self-evidently illegal, and they have a long history of decisions based upon political bias rather than good public policy.

Congress wrote and passed GCA'68. Thus it was congress that created the problem that need not exist in the first place

And it would be Congress that would pass the equally flawed national sales tax "prebate" system. That Congress has made terrible mistakes in the past in granting an unelected bureaucracy power over the control of firearms does not excuse or legitimize a future mistake such as granting an unelected bureaucracy power over the U.S. economy, something your "prebate" system does.

Members of congress violating their oath of office to empower most of the alphabet agencies. The IRS being but one of them. Congress created the problem. You have only tin-foil-hat assertions the the HHS would suddenly become a monster in regards to determining the poverty level

Do you realize what you are saying? You essentially admit that the bureaucracies have misused powers that Congress has granted them, but you somehow believe that the HHS will be magically immune to this abuse of power. Of course Congress "created the problem". But just because they've created such problems in the past doesn't excuse attempts to create even worse problems (such as the socialistic "prebate" system) in the future.

The system that you are advocating is flawed. When those fatal flaws (the ability of the secretary of the HHS to arbitrarily set the value of the government handout) are exposed, your response, rather than suggesting a correction to the flaw in the system, is to insist that somehow the HHS can be trusted with this arbitrary power and throw personal attacks at anyone who continues to point out the massive flaws in your system. And you still refuse to admit that a government handout to every household in the United States is socialism, when it quite clearly is.

[Zon]

and your assertion is a lie in any case. Robert Reich, Clinton's secretary of labor, has admitted that the administration didn't adjust the poverty level during the Clinton administration for fear that it would make the poverty rate would look worse. Check out the May 26, 2001 issue of the New York times for proof of his statement

I didn't know about that one specific Clinton strong arm tactic. I wonder what sort of initiatory threat of force Clinton used. Perhaps evidence is in the 900 illegally obtained FBI files that the Clinton's had possession of.

My claim that the HHS has a long track record of honesty was not a lie. It was an error. Since you don't know the difference between an error and a lie here's a quick lesson: Person A asks person B what day of the week it is. Person B responds, "it's Tuesday". Unbeknownst to person B it is actually Wednesday. Person B made an error not a lie. Had person B said "it's Tuesday" knowing full well it was actually Wednesday that would be a lie not an error. Now's your chance to correct your error and apologize for claiming that what I wrote was a lie.

That's one fraud compared to how many thousands of frauds and abuse by the IRS? IRS Abuse Reports -- The Case Against the IRS

Do you realize what you are saying? You essentially admit that the bureaucracies have misused powers that Congress has granted them, but you somehow believe that the HHS will be magically immune to this abuse of power.

I compare the track record of the basically honest HHS to the basically corrupt IRS. They are miles apart. Do you realize what you are saying? You, with your tin-foil hat assert: "They [HHS] can simply say the poverty level is $150,000." Thus overnight turn into a monster that the NRST is intent on kill a monster IRS in the first place. That you fail to acknowledge the wide disparity in the comparatively honest track record in the HHS calculating the poverty level from the track record of fraud perpetrated by congress regarding the graduated income tax is to be expected from persons that chose deceit over honesty.

Zon: You demonstrated your intent to deceive the reader. Thus rendering yourself not to be trusted or respected because you disrespect the reader. You probably think you can mislead and try to deceive the reader and that they should just comply with you and answer your questions or take you seriously. You deserve no person's attention in a discussion. Scorn. That's what you deserve. 936

Technogeeb: Your lies and personal attacks do nothing to refute the clear flaws in the system you are advocating. Government handouts to every household in the United States (the "prebate" mechanism) is socialism. To claim that it is otherwise is a lie. And since that system allows an unelected bureaucrat to determine the value of those handouts (with no additional action by Congress once the system is enacted), the only thing preventing it from becoming pure communism is the goodwill of the bureaucrats. 939

Your comments are on record; I'm glad to let the reader juxtaposition our comments.