AUTOPSY AND INVESTIGATIVE REPORTS ON THE DEATH OF CHIEF NEGOTIATOR

08/23/02 | Harris County Medical Examiner's Office, Houston Fire Department Fire/Arson Investigations

[Helen]

Thanks for passing on this information, Cob. It seems too many investigations are incomplete, roiled in incompetence, or brought to a halt in a frustratingly unsatisfactory manner. It's difficult to accept their conclusions when so many questions remain.

Chief is remembered fondly. May he rest in peace.

[HighWheeler]

"Forgive the stupid question, but I have no idea how these investigations are conducted.

This one was not conducted very well. If I turned in a fault report this piss poor, I would get my head handed to me.

I hope someone is still trying to answer the questions, but the report is so bad that I don't have any confidence it is still on-going. If it were on-going, the gaping, cavernous holes would at least be stated as such.

It is very disconcerting that Houston is the same place that has the K-mart incident where about 300 people were unlawfully arrested.

[meyer]

It would not be unusual to have tripped breakers at a fire scene such as this. As the fire heated the wires, the insulation would quickly melt and the conductors would short together, tripping the breaker.

One thing that might be more important is if a breaker failed to trip when there was a high-impedance fault or overload. This condition would result in a heated condition that could ignite a fire, though it would be within the wall and, I would think (and this is pure opinion here), a rather slow fire to develop. It might also have caused more structural damage such as it burned internally before being discovered.

[HighWheeler]

Thanks Victoria, I hope you had a good weekend. Now I'm all fired up on this thread, I won't fall asleep until about 4 am.

[COB1]

As in most cases, HW, you can start the blame for the mess that is Houston law enforcement at the top.
We have a mayor who would have a hard time being a competent dog catcher.

[F.J. Mitchell]

I'll bump that, Oldfriend- so far the results of the investigation of this atrosity by the experts in Houston, seems to reveal more about the incompentence of the investigators than clues to the cause.

A fire of such instant and immediate intensity, if not arson, is certaintly a concern that should trouble everyone in America. If the Chief was not the victim of foul play, then all of us who dwell in a semi-modern abode, face the same mysterious natural phenomenon that killed our friend.

If the authorities in Houston are unable to solve such an obvious case of murder by arson, maybe it is time for Homeland Security to become involved.

[MistyCA]

Which arson report do you have....signed by which investigator? Have you posted these in full? These reports do not have all of the information that was available, and the reports that I have read are full of inconsistencies and errors. The report said there was a partial shoe print on the door. Did it also say the doorframe was damaged or the door had been locked? All of the discussions I had with the investigators there was nothing that indicated to them (with all of their information) that there was a forced entry. There are lots of bits and pieces of information that would be inconsistent with the idea of forced entry. I would hate to see you or anyone else going off on a tangent that has been unsubstantiated. That's all. :)

[philman_36]

My bad. A DUH for me.

[patton]

(+)

[Helix]

I hope someone is still trying to answer the questions, but the report is so bad that I don't have any confidence it is still on-going. If it were on-going, the gaping, cavernous holes would at least be stated as such.

Thanks for the info. I have a sinking feeling you're right on target.

[MistyCA]

The Houston PD was not involved in this investigation.

[Humidston]

It's still there, COB. Overgrown, but still there! ;-)

Stay safe.

[MistyCA]

I don't want to get into this again, but there was no evidence of a fire bomb being thrown.

[carenot]

Maybe these guys fight so many fires that the details of any single fire become obscured in their memories.

I can understand them not remembering now. But for goodness sake wouldn't the investigators have talked to them a day or two after the fire when they might have remembered something about it?

[meyer]

re: aluminum wiring. Yes, there was a period when aluminum wiring was used in the era that you mentioned. Many times, there were problems with the dissimilar metals causing loose connections unless the properly rated receptacles and breakers were used. Loose connections do heat up (I have seen it myself as evidenced by charred breakers and such) and can cause fires. But usually, there needs to be a fair amount of current flowing through the connection for it to heat up. More current = more heat. And this type of problem will not usually trip a breaker unless or until insulation is melted sufficiently to cause a short circuit. So this is a potential source of fire.

The question is; was there sufficient current flowing across a loose connection in the dining room to create enough heat to start a fire? And, if it did, would it be a type of fire that grew at a sufficient rate as to surprise someone that was presumably alert in the next room?

[MistyCA]

Amen

[HighWheeler]

I just today saw the video of a 747 center tank being exploded on test. It was done as a response to the TWA 800 crash report.

The explosion was nearly nothing, as I expected. There just isn't enough total combustible material in fuel vapor at standard temp and pressure to detach the entire cicumference of a 747. The tank blew out part of one side only, and once the increasing pressure breeched the tank, the fire just farted out the side.

Now this.

I am too wound up.

[carenot]

I think the door IS significant, and I think the fact that the door had never been mentioned before this report is significant.

It must be, else why would it be mentioned in a report when little else is?

[Dog Gone]

We know that Chief was called away from the computer by his wife and they had their final kiss. We don't know for sure that he came back to the computer because he hadn't posted again before the fire, although Mrs. Chief said that he was going back to his computer.

Since he had posted and was actively working his final thread, it seems pretty likely that he did, in fact, head back to the computer and was there reading responses on his thread when the fire broke out.

If your theory of the case is that a crazy person did this (and we both know who that is), then I suppose it's possible that someone could have done what I think is implausible.

I am quite sure, though, that the burns didn't kill him. The smoke surely did. If his wife couldn't even get past the kitchen, I can only imagine what it was like in the den.

Do you know if there was a TV in the dining room?

[F.J. Mitchell]

"Aluminum wiring?"

Good point, I hadn't thought of that. Or worse yet, a mixture of copper and aluminum- tragedy guaranteed.

Could the geniuses have missed the obvious? Or be protecting Houston agaist a class action law suit, for the inept building codes and inspectors of recent history?