Research helps dispel marijuana myths

Sober Talk ^ | Thursday, August 1, 2002 | By BECKY CLARK, MSW, CSW

[Behind Liberal Lines]

As we endeavor toward a more lucid and informed discussion of substance abuse, let's deconstruct the mystique of marijuana and recognize it for the dangerous drug that it is.

Marijuana is a substance that's worthy of our concern. It is the most prevalent of all illicit drugs used in the country. The 2000 National Household Survey on Drug Abuse reported that 34 percent of Americans have used marijuana in their lifetime and 5 percent are current users.

[jayef]

What about cultivation? Should I be able to grow for my own use? Should I be able to share my crop with adults who ask for it?

[Zon]

all of the above is the same for alcohol, or being a posting member of FreeRepublic......

At what point does a woman decide that her habitually abusive husband is no longer a threat to her? At what point does a person decide that his debate opponent that is rife with non sequiturs and illogic has suddenly become rational?

First the husband must acknowledge that he has a problem. Likewise, first the irrational debater must realize that he or she has a problem.

[dirtboy]

I still find it interesting that the pro pot crowd here is so unwilling to accept or employ standard conservative/libertarian argument that notes the safety of the substance should generally be irrelevant to our right to consume same.

I, for one, have never claimed that pot is beneficial, except perhaps in a very limited use with AIDS and chemotherapy patients. I instead compare the harm that pot causes individuals and society, compare that to the harm and taxpayer expense that prohibiting pot causes, and come to the conclusion that the enforcement efforts against pot simply are not justifiable. Pot to me is fairly similar to alcohol in that both are widely used on a recreational basis, both can cause some impairment, and a small percentage of users develop dependency problems, but pot is banned and booze isn't. That's stupid. Best to have the states try different approaches towards pot to see what works best, and get the feds out of the picture.

[4Freedom]

Freedomcrusader, The Netherlands is tiny as compared to the United States. The whole country is similar in size to a state like Massachusetts and has a population of 14 million.

It's much easier for a citizen of The Netherlands to get a feel for statistics relating to their country than for a citizen of the United States to do the same.

It's comparable to residents of Northern and Midwestern states having a discussion about statistics, that have to do with illegal immigration, with a resident of a Southern border state.

Who's opinion would have the greater weight for you, there?

Don't answer that. I already know. The opinion of any Libertarian among them.

LOL!

[Hemingway's Ghost]

Should I be able to share my crop with adults who ask for it?

Damn straight you should.

[capt. norm]

"You know nothing, NOTHING about me and I'll advise you to keep your stupid mouth shut. "

Exactly. It is the liberal movement that wants to lump all us into groups instead of letting us be free individuals.,P.IFf what you're doing isn't politically correct, then you are "out of the mainstream" and therefor, have to be ridiculed, intentionally misquoted, demonized and, if possible, eliminated.

[jayef]

Lame because you say so. It is the only reason that I need. No victim, no crime. PERIOD!

Your argument is that it's for the good of society. NOW THAT IS LAME. Any you call us socialists. Ironic, eh?

[sweet_diane]

"I instead compare the harm that pot causes individuals and society, compare that to the harm and taxpayer expense that prohibiting pot causes, and come to the conclusion that the enforcement efforts against pot simply are not justifiable. Pot to me is fairly similar to alcohol in that both are widely used on a recreational basis, both can cause some impairment, and a small percentage of users develop dependency problems, but pot is banned and booze isn't. That's stupid. Best to have the states try different approaches towards pot to see what works best, and get the feds out of the picture."

Makes sense to me! And I am NOT a Libertarian or a libertairan (I really don't know what difference the L/l makes, I know it's really important to some of you).

[Wolfie]

Should I be able to share my crop with adults who ask for it?

I'll be right over!

[knighthawk]

The Germans did not legalized the sale of soft-drugs like the Netherlands did. Also posession of soft-drugs is still illegal in Germany.

The numbers come from the Foundation Trimbos, the official foundation sponsored by the Dutch government.

They can be found at http://www.trimbos.nl/

Here is on overview of Germany (G) vs. the Netherlands (N)

Cannabis use of the general population (1997)
N. 18% ever did use vs. G. 13%
N. 5% use in the last year vs. G. 5%

Cocaine use of the general population (1997)
N. 2,4% ever did use vs. G. 1,5%
N 0,7% use in the last year vs. G. 0,7%

Opiates (per 1000 citizens)
N. 2,5 vs. G. 2,2

XTC: no numbers on Germnay, but the Netherlands come out on number three (only Ireland and US do worse)

Amfetamines: here the Netherlands is on the European average

Although there are only small differences, the Germans never legalized soft-drugs.

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/713351/posts
The Netherlands take top spot in crime + Left gave crime a chance

Is about the enormous crime we face in the Netherlands. The same kind of crime that the people who said that legalizing soft-drugs would stop! Yes, theft would decrease they said. NOT!:

"The Hague - The Netherlands has to deal with extensive crime. Especially in the area of minor crimes like theft and vandalism the Netherlands takes the top spot."

"The DA-office compared the crime-statistics of nine countries: Denmark, Canada, Australia, Germany, Austria, France, UK, Sweden and the US."

"The comparison shows that the Netherlands are doing bad. The Netherlands almost has twice as much crimes per 1000 citizens the Austria and also the Netherlands tops the US. Especially in the minor crimes like theft and vandalism, threat and vandalization of cars the Netherlands tops the list.

When looking at the more serious crimes like burglary and violent crimes, the Netherlands hold a spot in the middle. The number of murders in Amsterdam and Rotterdam is also this year the highest amongst the investigated cities, expect those in the US. This top spot on the list the Netherlands has to thank to the high number of liquidations in the drugsscene."

---

NOT even one of the things the legislators promised came true, except that the heroine users in the Netherlands live the longest of all of Europe.

So by giving them a good life the Netherlands were wrecked, we have the reputation of being the number one drugs trafficing country in Europe.

A majority of people is sick and tired of all this. A sign: 2,6 million people voted for CDA, 2,2 million of those votes went to the biggest drug warrior in the Netherlands, the now minister-president Balkenende.

[dirtboy]

My single biggest accomplishment in my life will be kicking pot and cigarettes at the same time.

Good for you, that is something to be proud of. Now if I may ask a question - pot was negatively affecting your life. What would be the most beneficial path for the law to take towards that problem - legalize and ignore the problem, incarcerate you and give you a felony record if you got caught with a dime bag, or evaluate you and force you into treatment if you got caught with a dime bag?

[vin-one]

which 9 out of 10 posters on this thread will ever see the problem from the others point of view.

Since I am the only rational one here, Just listen to what I say and you will be fine.......

[4Freedom]

A couple left a 4-month-old baby in their car while they were in the coffee shop doing drugs?

The mother was probably breast-feeding, too.

[newcats]

Name me one person who even eats one potato raw?

I do...I do...I love raw taters...slice them up and munch them like chips. Soft yet crunchy. Don't knock it till you tried it.
Granted, I don't think I could handle 10 though.

[dirtboy]

(I really don't know what difference the L/l makes, I know it's really important to some of you).

An upper-case L indicates the person is a member of the Libertarian Party. A lower case l indicates the person has libertarian tendencies in their political beliefs, but is not a member of the party. I give credence to a few libertarian concepts, but I am a member of the GOP.

[Dane]

Yet I haven't seen you call anyone a liberdopian yet.

Why should I do the work when you all basically do the work of pointing out who the Liberdopians are on this thread.

Again the real question is, If you or I can have a beer and a cigarette, anytime of the day. Why can't I take a toke?

Wahhhhhh, life's not fair. Maybe you all can try to get an amendment to the Constitution saying "the right to toke shall not be infringed".

Tough road to hoe though, with only 5% of the population who smoke pot heavily.

[freedomcrusader]

a feel for statistics relating to their country than for a citizen of the United States to do the same.

A "feel" for statistics? Funny, when I took statistics in college, I don't remember disussing our feelings about them. The numbers don't change because you feel a certain way about them. What are the numbers?

You may have some insights about the numbers that I don't have, not having lived there, but the numbers don't change just because you live in one place and not in another.

Have crime rates and drug usage rates increased in the Netherlands since legalization, or haven't they? Once I know that, you can wax on at length as to why they've increased or decreased, and have much more authority than I do.

However, outside of arguments about how the numbers were generated, you do not have the authority to say that the numbers show the opposite of what they do just because you live there!

[dirtboy]

I simply prefer that people not f### up themselves with happy-weed all their lives so that someday I and other taxpayers will have to take care of them.

Want further illumination...check out comment #93.

Could you please show me in post #93 where the poster became a ward of the state? Try to keep your arguments consistent with your examples...

[Hemingway's Ghost]

I simply prefer that people not f### up themselves with happy-weed all their lives so that someday I and other taxpayers will have to take care of them.

You think people must forfeit their liberty for your preferences?