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To: WL-law
But I want to also take you up on the question of "intentionality". The question has to be answered OBJECTIVELY, not subjectively. The German player watched the ball move to his hand (away from his body, protecting the goal space that he couldn't legitimately block with his body or head) and ALLOWED the ball to strike his hand -- he made no attempt to move his hand, and note that the ball was not travelling quickly. OBJECTIVELY, that is "intentional", and I don't have to get into his mind as to whether he "meant" to do it.

If the hand was there first, then by definition of causality, it can't be there with the intention of handling the ball, as the player didn't know the ball was going there before he put his hand in that position. Thus it is not "deliberate" handling of the ball.

Now, I will grant you that if the ball were kicked from mid-field, and you saw it coming and left your hand were it was going, that would be deliberate handling, but in today's game there was very little time for anyone to react, as it was deflected up into his hand from a short distance away.

159 posted on 06/21/2002 4:36:18 PM PDT by longshadow
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To: longshadow
If the hand was there first, then by definition of causality, it can't be there with the intention of handling the ball, as the player didn't know the ball was going there before he put his hand in that position.

Here's what you're missing: a player doesn't stick his hand out away from his body, ESPECIALLY IN THE PENALTY AREA, because he can't legally control that space with his hand -- he risks a hand-ball penalty kick, yes? But on the goal line behind the goalie the German defender intentionally puts his hand OUT accepting the risk, because at worst he gets called and draws the PK, but if he doesn't do it and the ball passes him its an immediate goal. SO he INTENDS to precipitate contact with the ball, else he'd keep it close in, like all other defenders do in the box. Hence, he INTENDED to hit the ball with his hand.

187 posted on 06/22/2002 1:25:01 PM PDT by WL-law
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