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To: belmont_mark; Tailgunner Joe; DoughtyOne; Orion78; lavaroise; Scholastic; HalfIrish; ...
While I sympathize with the intent of your post here, I have to disagree with your read of history. The Treaty of Lucarno in 1925 was a belated attempt by the Allies to mend the massively unjust Treaty of Versailles of 1919 whose very oppressive terms were responsible for the rise of Hitler in the first place. It was concluded with a democratic Germany that was not lying, deceptive or corrupt, but one that was free, though economically downtrodden thanks to the Allies. It was not appeasement in the least. No there was never any appeasement of Hitler until Munich in 1938. Previous to that it was merely a question of allowing the Allied injustices toward Germany to be remedied.

Furthermore to say that Weimar Germany "was engaged in extensive, secret and evil war preparations" is a travesty and injustice to history. Nothing could be further from the truth. Germany was limited by the unjust Allies to an Army of only 100,000 with no tanks, planes, battleships, or heavy artillery. With the exception of some armor and aircraft prototypes tested in Russia, the Germans kept the terms of the Versailles Treaty until around 1934-35 when Hitler began trying to catch up with the much more massive Allied war machines. As late as 1937, the Allies could have crushed the German military with impunity. It took until 1940 for the Germans to build up to a level where victory over France was even hypothetically possible.

The primary lesson of history in the interwar period is not to conclude unjust one-sided treaties that constitute nothing but "the peace of the victors" and only secondarily not to appease one's enemies. Hitler could never have come to power in an economically prosperous Germany whose economy had not been destroyed by the oppressive and vengeful Allies with their $33 billion reparation payments. That being the case without Versailles there would have been no World War Two and thus no "great leap forward" for Communism in 1945-49. With a united Germany in place in the center of Europe allied with the Western powers against Soviet Communism, Communism would have remained checked at the eastern boundary of Poland in 1939. World War Two might have been fought between the West allied with Germany and the Soviet invaders of Eastern Europe.

Had there been no Hitler and no fall of France or Battle of Britain, FDR would not have likely goaded the Japanese to attack us at Pearl Harbor with his oil embargo which he fully expected would lead to a Japanese pre-emptive attack against us. Thus, the US would not likely have gone to war with Japan, which would not likely have invaded the Phillipines, Indonesia, Malaysia or Papua New Guinea and the Pacific Islands in a bid to resupply their Empire. As long as the Japanese Empire and not the Soviet Empire remained in control of Manchuria, Mao's Red Army could not be rearmed and resupplied and could never have conquered mainland China, which accordingly would have remained led by Christian Nationalists for decades thereafter. A war between the Western Allies and Germany against the most murderous regime in world history at the time--Stalin's Soviet Union--would have likely led to Soviet defeat and thus liberation of the entire world from Communism. We could have then dealt with the Japanese Empire at our leisure. History would have been very different indeed and would have turned out much better for the cause of world freedom.
29 posted on 09/07/2002 9:08:40 AM PDT by rightwing2
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To: rightwing2
Have you read either "Modern Times" by Paul R. Johnson or "While America Sleeps" by Kagan and Kagan? I think that perhaps there are nuggets of truth in what you wrote, however, I also believe that Weimar Germany was not nearly as innocent as many currently believe (and believed in the past). In fact, one major area of ongoing rationalization on the part of successive UK governments in not dealing with a resurgent Germany was taking the successive Weimar governments outward facades at face value. Vis a vis the 100,000 troop limit this was conveniently eluded by redesignating many troops as "internal security police." At one point I had similar views to what you wrote, however now I have learned a few new things that made me refine my views further. I guess in the end we can agree to disagree, because I know that you are a patriotic American and in favor of many of the same things I am. Take care!
30 posted on 09/08/2002 9:26:28 PM PDT by GOP_1900AD
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