Celibacy s history of power and money

National Catholic Reporter ^ | 4/12/2002 | Arthur Jones

[uncbob]

That will come as a suprise to many buddhist traditions that've been practising celibacy for quite some time now.

So they say
Maybe they have their own skeletons

[Mike Fieschko]

Peter/Cephas means "little rock,"

The exact translation of the Aramaic 'kepha' into Greek translates the Aramaic into 'petras', a feminine noun, inappropriate for an adult married male. I wonder if any womynchurch folks try to use the feminine form to argue for priestesses.

'Kepha' in Aramaic does not mean 'little rock'. The little vs. large distinction is introduced when the text is translated from Aramaic into Greek. At that point we have to chose between 'petras' (feminine) and 'petros' (masculine, 'small rock').

[Mike Fieschko]

Therefore, the requirement of celibacy is a purely human policy which, in the author's opinion, should be changed.

That it is a human policy is true. That it is this newspaper editor's opinion is also true.

I don't have a paper with a nationwide circulation, but the guy's a layman (I'm assuming), so his opinion and mine carry equal weight with the hierarchy.

If I used sneering, mocking, snide, etc. remarks in broadcasting my thoughts to my readership, I'd be speaking volumes about what I considered their intellectual abilities.

[Aliska]

The article must have been ghost written by Dave Hunt. ;-).

[SoothingDave]

Tugger, you're not imagining things. This should serve as a warning to any serious Catholic who still reads this rag of a "Catholic" newspaper.

Indulgences were and are guarantees signed and sealed by folks in no position to deliver on the promise. Indulgences were sold by those who had invented the idea of purgatory in the first place (there is no biblical basis for purgatory).

This guy here doubts two elements of the Catholic faith, and broadcasts this to his allegedly Catholic audience. He not only denies Purgatory, he also denies that the Church's Magisterium was given the power to bind and loose.

In short, this man is not a Catholic.

SD

[Mike Fieschko]

This should serve as a warning to any serious Catholic who still reads this rag of a "Catholic" newspaper.

This just in, Jack Chick to draw a weekly cartoon for 'National Catholic Reporter'.

[Brian Kopp DPM]

Thanks for posting that rebuttal, Mike. I get so sick of hearing the twisted logic and mental gymnastics of those who deny the clear, plain sense of scripture regarding Peter being the Rock, or even John 6:53 for that matter, that I hardly even bother rebutting it any more. Scripture is clear. Peter is the Rock. Christ built a Church, gave it the keys, gave it authority to lose and bind and forgive men's sins in His name. Early Christians understood this, even if the reformers and their heirs reject it.

[Malcolm]

Rebut it all you want, or not at all. The Rock is Christ. If you don't accept it, that's not the last word on it.....

[LadyDoc]

The NCREporter is the catholic equivalent of the National Enquirer. Except the National Enquirer has to check it's facts first.

Celibacy in those who seek holiness is not limited to Catholics. The tradition is ancient in the Eastern church, where married men can become priests but priests cannot marry, and where bishops come from the unmarried clergy.

Hindu holy men do not marry, nor do most Buddist monks, for example. Gandhi, for example, was married but became celibate later in his life when he decided to become a holy man. Indeed, one legal reason for divorce in India is if one's husband leaves to become a holy man.

Many "mystery" cults that predate Christianity encouraged celibacy (mainly in the East.).

Some of this is due to the "gnostic" influence, which feels that bodily functions including sex, are evil, and only the spirit is good. Christianity rejected that idea, but some influence remained. And, of course, what Paul said stays true today: That a married man or woman has to use much of their time pleasing the spouse, but an unmarried person can do the Lord's work full time.

[Mike Fieschko]

Thanks for posting that rebuttal, Mike.

Kind of providential that today's first reading is Acts 8:26-40, where

'Philip ran up and heard him [the Ethiopian] reading Isaiah the prophet and said, "Do you understand what you are reading?" He replied, "How can I, unless someone instructs me?"'

Whereupon Philip began to instruct him.

And the second reading is St John 6:44-51, where Our Lord says

'I am the living bread that came down from heaven; whoever eats this bread will live forever; and the bread that I will give is my Flesh for the life of the world.'

[sinkspur]

In short, this man is not a Catholic.

What is the biblical basis for purgatory?

Purgatory was defined by Catholic Tradition, which makes it binding on Catholics to believe. But you won't find anything about it in Scripture.

And belief or non-belief in indulgences is indicative of nothing. I would wager half of today's Catholics don't know anything about them, except for Luther's railing against the selling of them, nor have 95% of Catholics tried to obtain an indulgence.

Are these folks not Catholic either?

[Mike Fieschko]

Rebut it all you want, or not at all. The Rock is Christ. If you don't accept it, that's not the last word on it.....

Far from me to go against Our Lord's very (in the sense of truthful) words handed down to us by St Matthew (16:18).

[sinkspur]

Celibacy in those who seek holiness is not limited to Catholics.

So I suppose we married schmucks are just out of luck when it comes to holiness?

Monks used to flagellate themselves too, in the name of holiness.

John Paul II has done more to counter the continuing influence of gnosticism in the Church than any Pope in history.

[Catholicguy]

Actually, the article is a farrago of modernistic claptrap and ghastly "scholarship" festooned with typical liberal griping.

The definitive text is "The Apostolic Origins of Priestly Celibacy" by Christian Cochini. Please read the book before biting on the bitter bait trolled by those adrift from the barque of Peter. The NCR promotes authentic Catholicism as well as the Sierra Club promotes authentic care of the environment

Christian Cichini's book is packed with evidence and real actual Documents. Documents such as the Decretal written by Pope Siricius prior to 400 A.D. In this text, the Pope reminds ALL priests of their DUTY of perpetual continence (celibacy). He reasons the O.T. priests had the requirement to spend their year in the Temple without sexual congress with their wives. The N.T. priests do not sacrifice for just one year. They sacrificed daily; ergo, perpetual celibacy.

Cochini's scholarship is called remarkable. Henri Cardinal de Lubac; "This work is of first importance. It is the result of serious and extensive research. There is nothing even remotely comparable to this work in this whole 20th century"

I have owned my book for YEARS. Buy it yourself and quit the perfidy and ignorance of the NCR

[sinkspur]

Documents such as the Decretal written by Pope Siricius prior to 400 A.D. In this text, the Pope reminds ALL priests of their DUTY of perpetual continence (celibacy.

Siricius' Decretal was obviously not the final word on the matter, as Gregory VII had to reaffirm it more forcefully 700 years later by invalidating the marriages of ordained priests.

[Mike Fieschko]

What is the biblical basis for purgatory?

When Christ descended to the dead and preached the gospel (1 Peter 3:18-20, the Apostle's Creed), if those souls were in Hell, what was the point? If they weren't in Hell, 'where' were they?

[Mike Fieschko]

Siricius' Decretal was obviously not the final word on the matter, as Gregory VII had to reaffirm it more forcefully 700 years later by invalidating the marriages of ordained priests.

You are right to point out that over time, we humans become lax and disobedient. We need to persevere.

[Malcolm]

Not to be contrary, but Jesus did not commission the "Catholic" Church. Like I said, if you don't accept that, it's certainly not the last word on it. Why don't you read Fox's Book of Martyrs. It's an excellent demonstration of Catholicism. Not that "protestants" are innocent, but we don't claim that our church is the exclusive church either. I'm not a Catholic hater, just a truth lover, and I say again, Jesus did not commission the Catholic Church. Read into Scripture whatever comfirms what you already believe, but I will never believe that I have to be a Catholic to be saved or to be approved. It's Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, not infallible Popes, Cardinals, and their "Church" that decide that, and that I am truly thankful for.....