Kiwis guide troops to al Qaeda

I'm not a new zealander. I'm British, and yea, the New Zealand Govt. may be shirking, it may also seem that the Kiwis only have a few soldiers to send, but they maintain a high quality army for a population of just under 7 million. I bet theres more kiwis in there army than there are new yorkers in the US army, and theres more people in New York than in NZ. Logistically your right, the smaller countries like NZ do need US carriers (logistics), but please don't let it detract from the fine quality of men and women that come out of NZ, Australia and even Canada (discounting the French from Quebec), that are making a contribution to the war, no matter how small. After all Clark could have turned around and said 'F**k you'.

The contributions and ultmate sacrifices made by the individual soldiers is no different, no matter whether you serve in the massive US forces or the tiny NZ army.

When the bully was dishing out his punishment to his victim in the school playground, the victim was happy for any support, no matter how big or small. Anything that would tip the scales in his favour. America was the victim of a bully on 9/11, but the bully didn't really understand the capabilities of his victim, and the support his victim would receive. Lets hope peoples attitude in the US doesn't turn into that of the bully, because that would be sad. Thats the way I see it.

Den.

,,, thanx Den! We don't have 7 million here yet. The total number of people in NZ is about 3,8 million right now. I think more troops could be diverted if needed but what's needed at this stage is a unit that specialises in high ground winter territory and that unit's involved. There's no doubt a good level of background committment too from NZL.

Best wishes from NZL!

Your filter is working well.
Overtime.

Someone else has probably already filled you in, but...

Bracero program was a long ago program to bring Mexican workers into the US.
Obviously, farm labor.
Government required some controls on both sides - reasonable housing etc. and return after the growing season.
Lots of people gamed the program but at least is set some ground rules.

Program was killed way back when (meaining I don't remember when) largely because liberals thought it was not nice,
demeaning,
all that stuff.

No one at the time recognized that it was just a step toward this open border drek that even our not-really-a-liberal (but honest) president just might favor today.

Er,
OK
?

Please note my words before jumping into the thght panties thing...

"being largely OK folk lulled by their isolation and lack of natural enemies, there is always hope for the future."

You can't argue the isolation and lack of natural enemies part, and if you want to argue the "OK folk" element you are insulting a lot of very good people I met in a year and a half in Vietnam working with your Air Force.

Chill,
please.

,,, no, nobody filled me in on the Bracero deal yet - many thanx for explaining it.

Dont mind me man, Aimlow was just getting my goat. It was the 'socialist chute for 25 years line' I was calling you on...Its not a recent thing, and in the past it hasnt prevented us doing our share. No offence intended.

norton said :

Too bad that we can't manage to say thanks for even a small (but quite capable) contribution. Also too bad that NZ has gone so far down the socialist chute over the past 25 or so years.

It's OK, you can say it :-)

Blunder said :

Norton, NZ has been a socialist country since at least the 1930's; that fact did not stop us form serving with distinction in WW2, Korea, Vietnam, the Sinai, the Gulf, Bosnia, East Timor, or anywhere else we were dragged off to by other peoples squabbles and F*-ups

Add to that South Africa, WW1, Malaysia, Borneo, Namibia and a few others. It's interesting that New Zealand has never been directly attacked, yet has proven historically to happily ship its forces overseas as you say to assist others. New Zealand suffered more casualties in the second world war per head of population bar Russia. It is also noted that New Zealand blood (and that of allies) was being shed during WW2 while the US sat on it's hands until it was attacked at Pearl.

New Zealand is not a socialist country per-se, otherwise this description could be leveled at any Western democratic country whenever a left-wing government has it's time in office. Is Australia a socialist country because it has had socialist governments from time to time? Or the UK, with it's current socialist government- does that make the country socialist by nature? I don't think so.

Right wing governments have held office in New Zealand for more terms than the left wing in the last century.

aimlow said :

At least the australians have a robust 30,000 man army, air force, navy Considering that New Zealand is getting rid of it's air force and navy, it is nice to see that they have the ability to train such an elite unit of 25 men.

Er, no, aimlow, not getting rid of them.

The following article in the March 21 2002 Sydney Morning Herald doesn't paint a very robust picture of the ADF- this one here

Thank you, I was being sarcastic about the ADF. And NZ did have a fantastic reputation for fighting during WWII on behalf of the crown. And so did the US which had what at stake? Probably about as much as NZ. We held off on the japanese until we secured victory in Europe. My point is that the price we pay for coalition warfare is not worth the gain. Coalition warfare is a political decision, not a military one. Our country was attacked, we can defend ourselves. What little military capabilty any of the other country's have to offer is not worth the long term debt we will now owe to come to your aid in the future.

And you must be reading something different then the NZ major who works down the hallway on the cuts in your AF.

After 15 years in the USMC

15 years is not long.