Shooting Sparks Gun Modification

Yahoo News ^ | 7 March 2002 | Staff

[tx4guns]

I have a 1970's model 700 ADL 30-06. I have done some trigger work on it, and the 700 can go off if someone jacked with the trigger and made it too sensitive. Most of them come from the factory with about a 6lb pull, but after the trigger job, mine's close to 2lbs. Go any lighter than that, and it can go off. Best way to test it is with any empty chamber and bang the butt of the rifle on the floor a couple times with the safety off. I don't mind the safety feature the way it is, but it does make me feel better to not have to take the safety off to open the bolt. I don't want to glass my action and resight it in, so I'll just leave mine the way it is.

[Noslrac]

Thats the thing...if its a condition the manufacturer caused by botching the gun before I bought it...I would want the manufacturer to fix it, till I got what I paid for (a functioning gun).

[Noslrac]

If I break something...its my fault.

[45Auto]

Perhaps I misunderstood this article. I thought that this was in reference to the new, improved Remington 700 bolt system that has this really putrid little hole in the bolt shroud that is key-activated to lock the firing pin. Am I wrong? I have several of the older pre-firing pin safety units and I seem to remember that I did not have to snap the trigger safety off in order to open the bolt.

My take on this was that the woman could not open the bolt until she inserted the key and unlocked the firing pin stop. Before she did this, she moved the trigger safety lever to the front, and as soon as she unlocked the firing pin safety, the gun supposedly discharged when "her finger was nowhere near the trigger." It could also be that somebody tried to "lighten" up the factory trigger pull and went a little too far. Below about three pounds of pull, the gun can fire with a round in the chamber when the bolt is merely closed. I've seen it happen. Its not clear from this article just what the sequence of events was.

[Falcon4.0]

I just checked mine, and you do have to release the safety lever to open the bolt.
However this gun is an early model and I know the original owner and it has never released the firing pin while releasing the safety.
Hey and just for nostalgia, I work in the same room where this gun was first produced and coincidentally it is the same room where Kevlar was perfected.

[tx4guns]

The "bolt lock" mechanism that they are referring to is exactly what I stated. You cannot open the bolt with the safety on on these Pre-82 models. I have shot them since I was 10 years old, and it's always been a PITA to have to take the safety off to open the bolt and unload your rifle. It's an internal mechanism that is part of the old design. There is no key or instrument that you have to insert into the rifle to "unlock" the bolt, and in fact, I'm not aware of any rifle manufactured anywhere that has that feature.

[Falcon4.0]

Ya know, what else bothers me? I was always taught to unload the weapon outside. Before I got to the car and or the cabin. Not when I got home.

[tx4guns]

Is that facility Military, or is it a popular petrochemical plant?

[45Auto]

Its becoming clearer that the poor woman may have had her finger on the trigger; in any case, she sure as hell wasn't watching were the muzzel was pointing.

The new Remington bolt/firing pin safety must be something relatively new; I bought a Model 700 LTR about a year and a half ago with no little key operated hole in the bolt shroud. I bought another Model 700 ADL less than a year ago and it does have the new key safety feature, which I don't like at all. Here's what Remington has to say about this:

"Remington is offering a safety modification program to remove the bolt-lock mechanism from certain Remington bolt-action centerfire firearms made prior to March, 1982. (Post-1982 bolt-action firearms were not manufactured with bolt-lock mechanisms). To determine whether your firearm has a bolt-lock mechanism and is subject to the safety modification program, “click” on the model listed below and follow the directions included.

The unloading process for most bolt-action firearms with a bolt-lock mechanism cannot begin unless the manual safety is placed in the ‘F” or “Off or Fire” position. If you participate in the program your firearm will be modified to eliminate the bolt-lock feature and you will be able to unload your firearm while the safety is kept in the “S” or “ On Safe” position. The operation of your firearm will not otherwise be affected.

Here are the basic program elements:

The firearms will be cleaned and inspected and the bolt lock mechanism will be removed for $20.00 plus shipping and handling. We will return the gun to you with a $20.00 rebate coupon good towards the purchase of any Remington brand safety product (eye protection, hearing protection, cable and trigger locks, gun cabinets and gun safes.)

Please click on the centerfire model listed below to obtain more information on the program for the specific model, as there are some differences in the program based on model type:

• Model 700 • Model 600 • Model 660 • Model 721 • Model 722 • Model XP-100 • Model 40-X

The following bolt-action centerfire firearms are not subject to the Safety Modification Program. Please click on the model for more information on the firearm.

• Model 700ML • Sportsman 78 • Model 788 • Model 725 • Model Seven • Model 710 • Model 30, 30 Express

If you have a bolt-action rifle with a bolt-lock mechanism, and you do not wish to have the lock removed, you must be sure to follow this IMPORTANT SAFETY NOTICE: Be sure the rifle is pointing in a safe direction anytime you move the manual safety to the "F" or "Off or Fire" position. As soon as you have lifted the bolt, immediately put the manual safety back in the "S" or "On Safe" position and then continue the unloading process.

[mamelukesabre]

Except for a pump action rifle and lots of ammunition, I have never had a remington product. I thought about buying a model seven last summer though. I didn't realize that remington ever had a safety that had to be taken off to open the bolt. I never realized that there was such a thing as a bolt that locks with a key. I don't understand why anyone would ever want something like this or why any manufacturer would ever produce it. It's just dumb. There is nothing wrong with the standard mauser-type safety(or winchester). There is nothing better than this. There are 3 choices: safety off, safety on, and safety on with bolt locked. Why should there be anything else??????

[VRWC_Member428]

I've also heard of at least one case where a cop, while holding a suspect at gunpoint with a cocked semi-auto handgun, tried to "safe" his gun by pressing the decocker. The gun went off while pointing at the perp's head. Oops.

Somebody told me about how they once owned a Beretta semi-auto pistol with the 'safety de-cock'. He said he promptly sold the gun after it went off when he operated the 'safety de-cock'.

When I saw the Beretta pistols at a gun store, and saw how the de-cock worked, I thought it was madness! I don't care whose pistol I have. The only time I'll de-cock a semi-auto is AFTER I have removed the clip and the chambered round.

Still, I do own a Beratte .22 semi-auto pistol. (no safety de-cock) I got it for two reasons. One, it's cheap to shoot all day long. Two, it's something I can have for concealed carry until such time as I have enough money to buy the Kimber Compact CDP I want.

[herewego]

you've made no progress, pls let me know where you are./.....as per she requires

[spectr17]

The link below is to a discussion by a gunsmith (JBelk) who has testified in several court cases against Remington over the years regarding this safety issue on Remington rifles. Remington knew this safety was defective but yet did nothing. Only after the father (Augustis), of the little boy who was killed in Montana made it his cause to see that the guns were fixed did Remington announce the recall.

Remington Safety Link

[spectr17]

Its becoming clearer that the poor woman may have had her finger on the trigger; in any case, she sure as hell wasn't watching were the muzzel was pointing.

No, she and others who have had the safety fail DID NOT have their fingers on the trigger. The failure of the safety is well documeted in court by gunsmiths. You might also want to check out the post on the link I gave above by the SWAT team member who posted that they had 3 rifles inspected by Remington and cleared as okay, only to have 3 safety failures after they test fired them after receiving them back from Remington.

Granted, the mother should have had better muzzle control but Remington does bare some responsiblity for marketing a defective product and failing to correct the defect for over 50 years. If you need the court documentation, email Augustis in the link above. It will slap make you wonder what Remington was thinking.

[spectr17]

Ping for safety and to set the record straight. Please read the above link I posted.

[Persuasion]

No matter who's fault it is, this has to be awful for the family. Prayers are with them.