Caution: Driver license rule-makers at work

Memphis Commercial Appeal ^ | February 24, 2002 | James W. Brosnan

[Inge_CAV]

"What we have here is a broken driver's license system," said Jason King, a spokesman for the American Association of Motor Vehicle Administrators (AAMVA)."

What we Really have here is a failure to comunicate.

We do not want them in this country to start with.

[NoControllingLegalAuthority]

If state motor vehicle administrations were linked electronically to the databases of such agencies as the FBI and Immigration and Naturalization Service, it would be "virtually impossible" for an alien to get a fake ID

Boy, is this wildly optimistic! The INS has ordered the deportation of 314,000 illegal aliens it cannot find. The INS has been described by those who know it best as the most incompetent of all federal agencies. Yesterday, I was told the INS has a standing order with police in my state that if a carload of illegal aliens is stopped and they have not violated any law other than immigration law, LET THEM GO!

How do you like that, America?

[GailA]

It's the same in most state I'd suspect. NO jail room to hold them in the first place. Memphis jail is OVERCROWDED and under Fed court orders on it.

Now for the BARF ALERT:

Guest column: Tennessee driver's license law promotes safety

The new Tennessee law that allows people without Social Security numbers to apply for driver's licenses is good public policy. Since the law passed last spring, it has made our state a much safer place in which to live.

Guest columnist David Lubell is community outreach coordinator for Latino Memphis Connection, a nonprofit social service agency.

The arrests at the Summer Avenue driver's license testing center this month, and the tragic death of state license examiner Katherine Smith that followed, have shocked the Memphis community. Looking for answers, many people have latched onto the idea that the new law is somehow to blame.

ALTHOUGH IT is tempting to embrace this conclusion, we do so at our peril. Repealing the license law, or tightening it so that most immigrants would no longer qualify under it, would do nothing to prevent terrorism. Instead, it would cause grave public safety problems for our city and state.

More than 20,000 individuals in Tennessee have obtained licenses as a direct result of the new law. Before it took effect, most of these people were driving without licenses.

They did not know our state and federal traffic laws. Many may not have known that in this country, a driver must stop when a school bus's red lights are flashing.

Before the law, none of these 20,000 motorists could obtain auto insurance. The dangers inherent in that situation are obvious.

And none was identifiable to police. Unlike their licensed counterparts, their names and photos were not in the state database. When a police officer stopped one of these individuals, the officer had no idea whether the driver had been pulled over or arrested before, or was subject to outstanding warrants.

Ever since Gov. Don Sundquist signed the driver's license law last May, a small minority of lawmakers led by state Sen. Marsha Blackburn (R-Brentwood) has called for its repeal. Many in this group were appalled by the idea of giving licenses to noncitizens, despite the new law's many positive implications for public safety.

This opposition at first found additional support among people who were forced to wait in excessively long lines at local driver's license testing centers. The Tennessee Department of Safety clearly did not expect the large volume of individuals without Social Security numbers who flocked to their doors soon after the law took effect.

But these lines did not last. As public discontent with them began to die down, so did the attempt to repeal the license law.

In the wake of the Sept. 11 terrorist attacks, Blackburn and her cohorts adjusted their arguments to play on our newest fear. They now claim the new law, by failing to require a Social Security number, made it easy for terrorists to obtain driver's licenses.

This argument also failed to persuade many people. All of the Sept. 11 terrorists, with their global support network, had Social Security numbers.

Public attitudes changed, however, when the driver's licensing scandal exploded in Memphis. The arrests of five Middle Eastern men at the Summer Avenue testing station suddenly appeared to lend credibility to the opposition's stance.

Many people who were previously ambivalent about the law began to label it too lax. After all, the suspects reportedly stated that one of the reasons they came to Tennessee for driver's licenses was that there was no Social Security requirement.

UPON CLOSER scrutiny, though, this argument loses much of its credibility. The suspects would not have been able to obtain Tennessee driver's licenses were it not for their alleged use of bribery.

The fact that they had to pay for the licenses should be evidence that the law is strict enough. Otherwise, why didn't they just obtain the licenses legally?

The suspects lacked the proper documentation: Someone without a Social Security number must show two government-issued forms of identification, one with photo, and two proofs of Tennessee residence, such as a utility or telephone bill in the person's name. For this reason, the suspects allegedly paid more than $1,000 apiece to have licenses issued to them under assumed names and identities.

The suspects came to Tennessee because they had connections to an allegedly corrupt official, not because of the state's driver's license law. It doesn't matter how strict a state's licensing requirements are; if corruption is involved, people will slip through the cracks.

Last September, 20 Middle Eastern men were arrested in 10 states - including Tennessee - and charged with obtaining driver's licenses illegally by bribing a transportation official in Pennsylvania. In Florida, 28 people were arrested last November and charged with getting licenses by bribing Department of Motor Vehicles workers there. Several of the suspects were illegal immigrants.

Let's think twice before we jump to conclusions about Tennessee's driver's license law. By getting rid of the law in the hope of making our state a safer place, we would actually do just the opposite.

[NoControllingLegalAuthority]

It's the same in most state I'd suspect. NO jail room to hold them in the first place. Memphis jail is OVERCROWDED and under Fed court orders on it.

Illegal immigrants are violating federal law and should not be jailed in Memphis or ANYWHERE else. They should be hauled by bus or train to the border as soon as they are caught.

[GailA]

I know, but jail would be the place to hold them until they can process them. Me I'm for pitching tents like they do in AZ to house them in until they process them. The government sure loves it's paper work.

Hubby has a questions, if other States are no longer recognizing our DL's does than mean our DL's are invalid in other States and we are now driving illegally in them? Does this also apply to CDL holders? If that is the case then it creates all kinds of legal nightmares. Insurance would not be valid in case of a wreck. Would you be permitted to continue driving if you were stopped? Or would you have to get some one else with a "valid" license from another State to come move your car? Could you be charged with driving with out a license?

These questions have not been addressed or even voiced. As more and more States consider Tennessee a rogue state and refuse to recognize our DL's we need to start asking our lawmakers to clarify this to us.

[NoControllingLegalAuthority]

I do not know the details of the laws in the four states (so far) refusing to recognize Tennessee driver's licenses. My guess is if they don't recognize TN licenses as valid, they could technically consider you are driving without a license. There is a federal issue regarding interstate travel which might come into play. The federal government could intervene and say that a license "war between the states" might violate Section 1 of Article IV of the U.S. constitution regarding "Full faith and credit shall be given in each state to the public acts, records, and judicial proceedings of every other state...."

Commercial Drivers License (CDL) requirements are more stringent. I have one issued in Tennessee and had to take comprehensive written and driving tests which I do not think would be considered invalid by other states.

[mindprism.com]

There is a federal issue regarding interstate travel which might come into play.

I remember being told in school, or possibly drivers training, that if you were subject to a states 'higher fine schedule' for out-of-state drivers, you could submit the ticket to your congressman for payment (reimbursement).

Not that I 'believe' it would be so easy...

but it would seem to be jailed etc by another state for having a Tenn. DL, you would have a decent court case if not some venue of recouping your losses by going to US GOV.

[mindprism.com]

All those who do not wish to become "unpersons" please form a line to the right.

[Shermy]

Good find sarcasm. Post at 3 a.m.? :(

Here's my latest template - anyone tell me if I should add links, etc.

Feb. 7

Six Charged in Tenn. License Plot [Courtesy of the Tennessee DemocRAT Party]

Feb. 8 (for comedic relief)

Dri ver license fraud case here is a rare incident, state says

Feb. 11

WOMAN ARRESTED FOR AIDING ARABS IN DRIVER'S LICENSE SCAM PRESUMED DEAD

Tennessee finds a cost to easing driver's license rules Some other states, airlines no longer accept (Boston Globe)

Feb. 12

Feds fear license examiner is dead - Memphis Woman's co-defendants tied to 9/11, judge told

Feb. 13:

Body in car identified as license examiner - Update on Memphis, Tennesse License Examiner

Feb. 14

TENN DRIVER LICENSE SCANDAL: FLAMING DEATH NO ACCIDENT, FBI SAYS

TENN DRIVER LICENSE SCANDAL: FLAMING DEATH NO ACCIDENT, FBI SAYS (II)

Flaming death no accident, FBI says - Gasoline found on clothes of license examiner

Feb. 15

New York Times (with Pics of car) F.B.I. Says Arson Killed Woman Accused in License Scheme

Sm ith led low-impact life until arrest, fiery end (Not a thread)

Images of the burned car owned by Katherine Smith * alternate title: How Arabs Kill Witnesses

FBI Agent: Arson Killed Key Suspect (driver's license examiner accused of supplying terrorists)

Feb.16

License suspect had WTC repair pass, but Port Authority did its own work [Tennessee License Scandal]

TE NN DRIVER LICENSE SCANDAL: FLAMING DEATH NO ACCIDENT, FBI SAYS

Feb. 18:

Mourners remember the good deeds of license examiner, not how she died

Feb. 20

State Immigrant I.D. Llicense for Disaster, Foes Say [Tennessee License Scandal - Business as Usual]

Terror in Tennessee? (Front Page magazine)

Feb. 22

Terroris m expert [Steven Emerson] monitors the Mid-South (WMC-TV Memphis 2/23)

*TN License Scandals

Pics of License Scam suspects

Color Pics of Suspects

Other Stories

I-70 Traffic Stop Turns Up $300K In Cash, Undocumented Jordanian (Al Qaida Operative?) [2/22 Utah]

Licenses for undocumented aliens steer legislators both ways - Driving: INS official says passage of bill would make deportation more difficult; proponents say it would give sense of identity (Kansas 2/20)

***Grass roots, politicians differ on immigration (2/14 plus Grover Norquist Barf Alert)

FBI investigating ‘‘mass destruction’’ inquiry (2/21 Somali asks U. of Memphis professor for weapons advice

GAO Report Finds “Pervasive and Serious Problem”” with Immigration Benefit Fraud Terrorists and Drug Dealers Manipulating Benefits Application Process To Carry Out Criminal Activities

Man on FBI watch list spotted (2/23 Iraqi, with Saddam Connections, in truck with OK lic. Plates, Picking up chemicals in Michigan. Egads!)

And don’t forget the stories about the Doctor who “fell” off a Memphis bridge!

[FITZ]

The INS has ordered the deportation of 314,000 illegal aliens it cannot find. The INS has been described by those who know it best as the most incompetent of all federal agencies.

The INS should get trained by the IRS. The IRS certainly knows how to go after people.

[Victoria Delsoul]

Good links. Thank you.

[Fred Mertz]

Sen. Richard Durbin (D-Ill.) plans as early as this week to introduce legislation that would give states three years to adopt a common format for licenses, including a biometric identifier like a holographic thumbprint or retinal scan.

Oh, this is great. Time for me to exit stage left until sanity returns to this country, which is doubtful.

[1 FELLOW FREEPER]

And who is in charge of the INS....Bush.

[KC_for_Freedom]

And before Bush, Clinton. The problem will not get better until we devise a method to determine the intent of the immigrant. Hurt us or assimilate. Step one would be a moritorium on immigration. Stop everyone. Fill the holes in the border and keep everyone out. Then revisit the 1964 immigration law that has no specific criteria for entry. Add a review of character to all applicants. And review their history. Have they lived in camps in the Sudan? Sorry, no visa. Have this review take place on their soil. No flight either. How many steps is this?

[GailA]

Sounds perfectly logical to me. I'm for a 10 year moritorum on immigration. It will take that long to weed the illegals out.

[Travis McGee]

Just put the BATF in charge of arresting illegals: they'll all be arrested, deported, shot or burned alive in one month.

[JDGreen123]

Problem is, the IRS brings in government money while the INS "not" working brings in corporate profits and voters to increase the size of government. Of course we all loose with both agencies.

[knighthawk]

Also look at post #10

[knighthawk]

Stop everyone

But what about me? I wasn't planning on staying much longer here in Europe!