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To: 1stFreedom
If the Church was in error in the proposed range (100ad-312ad), then how could the errant church be trusted to be correct about the cannon of Scripture?

God used Pharoah's hardened heart to His own ends, does that venerate Pharoah?

Many schools of theology contend that the Church had a falling away, or went apostate, not too long after the death of the last Apostle.

Be careful here. "The Church" can never be apostate or else it wouldn't be "The Church." Nor is "The Church" dependent upon human organization -- it is plainly from God, not man.

The debate is not whether "The Church" went into apostacy, but whether Catholicism constitutes "The Church." To do so, Catholicism's first test is adherence to scripture, a test that it fails as plainly as the nose on your face.

107 posted on 01/18/2002 10:29:42 AM PST by hopespringseternal
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To: hopespringseternal
>>God used Pharoah's hardened heart to His own ends, does that venerate Pharoah?

God never used such characters for continued good. He did convert some, but they remained good.

>>Be careful here. "The Church" can never be apostate or else it wouldn't be "The Church."

Now you are getting somewhere.

>> Nor is "The Church" dependent upon human organization -- it is plainly from God, not man.

Uhh, it was dependant on humans from the beginning my friend. From Christ himself ( although He was also God) to his apostles who organized the worldwide universal (Catholic) Church, the Church has been dependant on human organization. There was only one Church up till like 500ad when the monophysytes were condemned/broke off or whatever happened. (Catholic is latin for universal)

>>The debate is not whether "The Church" went into apostacy, but whether Catholicism constitutes "The Church."

Nope. Not really. In the first 500 years of Christianity, there was no church cept the what was called the Catholic Church till some minor and major breaks. You are confusing the term Catholic with a denomination. Catholic is merely the universal faith that existed in / post Christ, taught by the Apostles, and by the successors of the Apostles.

>> To do so, Catholicism's first test is adherence to scripture,

Nope my friend, that is YOUR test, based upon the ideology that Scripture is the sole authority (which is NON BIBLICAL).

Actually the criteria to determine what is the Church and what isn't is the history of the Church. Catholicism, the Orthodox, and a few sects can be historically traced to the Apostles (Apostolic lineage). Modern, post "reformation" church's, for the most part, can't. (Some Anglican priests and others can.)

113 posted on 01/18/2002 10:48:31 AM PST by 1stFreedom
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